School Shootings

[metallica86]

I've been wondering a lot about things like this lately. I'm starting to think that maybe school shootings aren't caused only by bullying, but also school itself. Think about it, if you force a few million teenagers to confirm to something they hate, eventually a few of them are going to crack and finally show everyone how de up with the system they are.

I don't know, just a thought that's probably been done before, but oh well

[metallica86]

*fed up

Sorry

[James Comey]

I'd imagine the Columbine killers (Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold) were probably quite fed up with the system, perhaps just as much as we are. Unfortunately, people like Harris and Klebold, alongside with many other people, vented in the wrong way, which is why I'm glad we have this community.

[Chanku]

I think I remember reading something in which the Columbine shooters wanted to spark a student revolution or something like that....

[James Comey]

If that was their intention, they definitely did the opposite of that, considering that the Columbine shootings helped increase the security at schools. Also, it's interesting if that's true. It shows that frustration within the system has existed for a long time.

[metallica86]

Reading about Eric Harris is interesting, because of his journal and all of that. Really makes you wonder how his mind worked.

And if they tried to start a revolution, they did it the wrong way, but who's to say we can't start a revolution? I'd be for it

[James Comey]

Revolution does not happen without controversy.

It all depends how we want to start it. I think the problem with starting a revolution against the factory model schooling is that so many people are attached to the system, and it's seen as a way of life, or a part of life. I've been thinking the right thing might be to start some kind of renaissance, like an anti-schooling art movement, or a rise in anti-schooling literature and media. We have War on Kids as one big movie. There was a user named Dominique who published a book but hasn't been very active since she registered. I remember Doc Johnson published a book called What About Us?, though he hasn't been around here since January 2012.

[Chanku]

I have an idea. We get older, get jobs in the government, or as teachers, and start trying to 'break' the system. The politicians can try and make school better(if possible), or can at least speak-out against factory model schooling. The teachers can talk to the students and tell them about factory model education. Also Maybe a few of us should start schools and stuff. For example I am thinking about wanting to start up a Democratic School when I'm older, as where I live there is only one democratic school, and it's not that good....

[metallica86]

All good ideas

[brainiac3397]

Or you all support my claim to the throne of Emperor of Earth and Ill be sure to remember to fix the education system once I crush all my foes, destroy their homes and burn their...hair I guess.

[Trar]

Remember, the majority of these shooters were also mentally ill. Which could have been exacerbated if not outright caused by factory schooling. Go figure.

[James Comey]

^Not to mention the massive stigma and lack of public understanding behind mental illnesses as well.

[xcriteria]

(01-30-2014 01:50 PM)Hansgrohe Wrote:  It all depends how we want to start it. I think the problem with starting a revolution against the factory model schooling is that so many people are attached to the system, and it's seen as a way of life, or a part of life. I've been thinking the right thing might be to start some kind of renaissance, like an anti-schooling art movement, or a rise in anti-schooling literature and media. We have War on Kids as one big movie. There was a user named Dominique who published a book but hasn't been very active since she registered. I remember Doc Johnson published a book called What About Us?, though he hasn't been around here since January 2012.

Very good points. There needs to be more media created... this is something I'm very interested in myself, though it's taking me a while to make it happen. (I wrote about this in 2009: What hates school, loves learning, and isn't doomed? -- what's happened since then is a long story, but the need for media remains... and fortunately there have been some examples since...we jut need more.)

(01-30-2014 01:54 PM)Chanku Wrote:  I have an idea. We get older, get jobs in the government, or as teachers, and start trying to 'break' the system. The politicians can try and make school better(if possible), or can at least speak-out against factory model schooling. The teachers can talk to the students and tell them about factory model education. Also Maybe a few of us should start schools and stuff. For example I am thinking about wanting to start up a Democratic School when I'm older, as where I live there is only one democratic school, and it's not that good....

Or, in the meantime, we can communicate with those who have these jobs and figure out what we can do in collaboration. I've found quite a few educators on G+ and FB who agree things need to change. It's hard to bring people here to the SS forums, but I encourage everyone to check out the SS G+ community and join in conversations there and elsewhere on G+, or start your own.

As for the government, StuVoice.org has the attention of US Sec. of Education Arne Duncan, and it's possible to educate those in government and education about different ways of looking at things. mpoole suggested sharing the Failing Superman video with school staff and see how they respond.

Several of us on G+ are taking the course New School Creation (see the G+ group here), which has a bunch of educators who want to create new and different schools. So, a lot more adults are open to doing school differently than it may appear. (It's certainly taken me a long time to start to find them, though!)

[xcriteria]

(01-30-2014 03:44 PM)brainiac3397 Wrote:  Or you all support my claim to the throne of Emperor of Earth and Ill be sure to remember to fix the education system once I crush all my foes, destroy their homes and burn their...hair I guess.

You up for playing that role in a short film?

[xcriteria]

(02-02-2014 10:13 AM)Trar Wrote:  Remember, the majority of these shooters were also mentally ill. Which could have been exacerbated if not outright caused by factory schooling. Go figure.

Yet, whenever these incidents happen, the discussion goes straight to how to increase security and ban weapons, rather than anything to do with how school works. :(

[James Comey]

It's ironic considering that there were security cameras in place during Columbine and Zero Tolerance policies were pretty much in full force by this time.

[Trar]

(02-02-2014 11:13 AM)xcriteria Wrote:  

(02-02-2014 10:13 AM)Trar Wrote:  Remember, the majority of these shooters were also mentally ill. Which could have been exacerbated if not outright caused by factory schooling. Go figure.

Yet, whenever these incidents happen, the discussion goes straight to how to increase security and ban weapons, rather than anything to do with how school works. :(

As much as sensible gun regulation is a good idea, the changes we'd like to see in schooling are pretty damn major; much bigger than the aforementioned gun regulation. Even if a politician or a couple of them were aware of the issues with the factory model, it would be an uphill legislative battle to do much about it, primarily because many people still need to learn about this sort of thing. You think we could improve things politically? I think we might, keyword being might.

(02-02-2014 11:12 AM)xcriteria Wrote:  

(01-30-2014 03:44 PM)brainiac3397 Wrote:  Or you all support my claim to the throne of Emperor of Earth and Ill be sure to remember to fix the education system once I crush all my foes, destroy their homes and burn their...hair I guess.

You up for playing that role in a short film?

Would watch this.

[xcriteria]

(02-02-2014 11:16 AM)Trar Wrote:  As much as sensible gun regulation is a good idea, the changes we'd like to see in schooling are pretty damn major; much bigger than the aforementioned gun regulation. Even if a politician or a couple of them were aware of the issues with the factory model, it would be an uphill legislative battle to do much about it, primarily because many people still need to learn about this sort of thing. You think we could improve things politically? I think we might, keyword being might.

Journalists becoming aware of the issue would be a good start. As for politicians, here's one conversation that hits roughly on this question of changing school to support people's minds ("social and emotional learning," etc.)

This is congressman Tim Ryan (who wrote a book about the benefits of mindfulness) questioning Sec. of Ed Arne Duncan back in 2010:



Watch on YouTube

Duncan: "We have to create climates that give students a chance to be academically successful, and if we're not addressing social and emotional needs, quite frankly we're kidding ourselves."

Now, how does that apply to completely transforming education to be about learner needs? It's a big question, especially when educators tend to have liked school, and are trained and paid to teach single-subject, age-graded classes, where the output is a report card that parents know how to read.

So many pieces in that puzzle... including the reality that different students are motivated by different things and have different reasons for being in school.