so yea I actually survived school, but.......

[eerie138]

.....I'm a parent of a kid who is struggling terribly in school. I thought joining this forum would enable me to help him. It's amazing to me how many kids out there feel EXACTLY the same way he does about school. Right now, I am trying to find educational alternatives, one of which will hopefully inspire him to finish out high school. He is now a junior. I don't even care if he decides to drop out and get his GED. I just don't want him to give up on his future because all these stupid-ass--haha i mean 'well-meaning'--teachers have made him feel so apathetic and discouraged about absolutely everything. I will welcome any advice/ideas you all have

[Missile]

Your kid is not alone,

Lots of us shares his opinion

[eerie138]

(01-08-2015 10:43 PM)Missile Wrote:  Your kid is not alone,

Lots of us shares his opinion

so what can I do to help him? It's killing him

[Missile]

Let him drop out,
I really don't have hopes that he would graduate anyway

[eerie138]

(01-08-2015 11:29 PM)Missile Wrote:  Let him drop out,
I really don't have hopes that he would graduate anyway

I feel pretty much the same. He will either just flunk out or explode. But where do people go from there, you know? I myself have considered finding a way to live off the grid in some type of otherworld where you don't have to live by all these rules that make no sense.....try to turn everyone into mirror images of each other. How do you do that?

[brainiac3397]

Build his self-confidence so he doesn't rely on others opinions and hopefully chooses to succeed for the sheer purpose of screwing the system.

[SoulRiser]

Welcome to SS

As for how to do things, it varies depending on where you live. Have you heard of unschooling?

Relevant links:
http://www.school-survival.net/alternatives/
http://alternativestoschool.com/

What does he actually like to do?

[eerie138]

(01-09-2015 04:08 AM)brainiac3397 Wrote:  Build his self-confidence so he doesn't rely on others opinions and hopefully chooses to succeed for the sheer purpose of screwing the system.

The sad thing is I have been this parent @:
http://forums.school-survival.net/showth...?tid=32998

i don't even know if he trusts me enough any more to let me help him recoup what confidence I have been instrumental in destroying in him

[eerie138]

thank youI didn't know how you all would feel about a parent partaking in this forum. you guys have a ton of insight. very impressive. I've seriously only realized myself that maybe he doesn't need to toe the line and stay the course and all the other bs parents/teachers/pastors etc etc say. so I haven't looked into any other options. I will now certainly. both links you gave will be handy. we live in ohio. not a terribly cosmopolitan take on the world from here. pretty much no one will question the school system with any aspiration to better it....or find another way entirely

[Missile]

Your son may be having sucididal thoughts
I know this from personal experience with my cousin

[eerie138]

I think you have a point. I'm sure if things stay the way they are it will come to that.

[SoulRiser]

It may take some time, but I think you can regain that trust again... as long as you show him that you're changing.

We do actually get parents here from time to time, believe it or not.

Just for interest's sake, I've always wondered about the point of view of "that parent"... what drives you to do things like that?

[lisafromjackson]

Thanks for posting here! I'm a parent as well. There are so many ways to become educated! Follow some of the resources here and keep posting! Also maybe tell him about us and have him post here or participate in the chat. He will definitely find kindred spirits here.

[eerie138]

I'm not surprised you've had some other parents here, but pleasantly surprised that you're taking the time to help a parent☺️i don't want to be the enemy of son....or any other kid. the reason that I behaved in such a reprehensible way is that I had bought into the system. it's so complicated and I don't think I can explain it briefly, but suffice it to say the way I grew up eventually demanded that I give in and become a lemming, or so I thought. i didn't trust my instincts enough to stay true to myself. I sold out. after reading threads in this forum I realized how wrong I was. my son has a viable reason to abhor school. I thought he was being defiant, but he was trying to tell me he needs me to understand him and be an advocate for him. I will regret that forever. now that I've seen the truth, I'll do what it takes to help him.
I have a question for you: how old are you and what's your story?

[eerie138]

lisafromjackson: thanks for your post. has being involved in this forum helped you? my son is 16 so I don't know if I've come to this great epiphany too late, but I really can't give up on him. and I finally realized that being 'different' is not an affliction as I've been convinced to believe, but actually a really great thing. I will encourage him to post here, bug I doubt he will. he's just like that ?

[lisafromjackson]

I came to this site out of my interest in changing education and helping kids who are struggling to survive school. My kids don't hate it but they see all the problems. They tell me their observations and what they think about how kids are treated.

Don't worry about him being 16, it is never too late to tune in.

[James Comey]

(01-08-2015 10:34 PM)eerie138 Wrote:  .....I'm a parent of a kid who is struggling terribly in school. I thought joining this forum would enable me to help him. It's amazing to me how many kids out there feel EXACTLY the same way he does about school. Right now, I am trying to find educational alternatives, one of which will hopefully inspire him to finish out high school. He is now a junior. I don't even care if he decides to drop out and get his GED. I just don't want him to give up on his future because all these stupid-ass--haha i mean 'well-meaning'--teachers have made him feel so apathetic and discouraged about absolutely everything. I will welcome any advice/ideas you all have

Hey eerie138, your son is not alone in the many, many teenagers that despise school, and you're not alone in the number of adults that are challenging boring, tedious, and irrelevant 19th century factory model education in 2015.

One of the steps that would help would, if possible, allowing your son to drop out of school and pursue a GED.

Hidden stuff:

Remember that, a GED is legally equivalent to a high school diploma. Forget about the drop out stereotypes - in law this does not exist at all.

College is still an option if your son decides to pursue a GED. A GED is basically a "get out of jail free card", really.

Another very important thing to consider is your own son's perception of school, and how his teachers, peers, etc affect him. For some high school is like a typical teen TV show; for others, it's absolute living hell. If so, it's actually quite recommended that you pull your son out if it really is taking a toll on him. Believe me, it's absolutely not worth it.

Does your son happen to be in Special Education, or have an IEP?

One more option is to consider democratic schools, tutoring programs, online schooling, etc as practical options. It may be worth researching if these options exist in your area.

Take Care

[eerie138]

(01-09-2015 03:02 PM)Hansgrohe Wrote:  

(01-08-2015 10:34 PM)eerie138 Wrote:  .....I'm a parent of a kid who is struggling terribly in school. I thought joining this forum would enable me to help him. It's amazing to me how many kids out there feel EXACTLY the same way he does about school. Right now, I am trying to find educational alternatives, one of which will hopefully inspire him to finish out high school. He is now a junior. I don't even care if he decides to drop out and get his GED. I just don't want him to give up on his future because all these stupid-ass--haha i mean 'well-meaning'--teachers have made him feel so apathetic and discouraged about absolutely everything. I will welcome any advice/ideas you all have

Hey eerie138, your son is not alone in the many, many teenagers that despise school, and you're not alone in the number of adults that are challenging boring, tedious, and irrelevant 19th century factory model education in 2015.

One of the steps that would help would, if possible, allowing your son to drop out of school and pursue a GED.

Hidden stuff:

Remember that, a GED is legally equivalent to a high school diploma. Forget about the drop out stereotypes - in law this does not exist at all.

College is still an option if your son decides to pursue a GED. A GED is basically a "get out of jail free card", really.

Another very important thing to consider is your own son's perception of school, and how his teachers, peers, etc affect him. For some high school is like a typical teen TV show; for others, it's absolute living hell. If so, it's actually quite recommended that you pull your son out if it really is taking a toll on him. Believe me, it's absolutely not worth it.

Does your son happen to be in Special Education, or have an IEP?

One more option is to consider democratic schools, tutoring programs, online schooling, etc as practical options. It may be worth researching if these options exist in your area.

Take Care

Thanks for your input Hansgrohe (and everyone else!). I intend to find out how to go the GED route, but I'm afraid he isn't a very motivated dude. Like he would rather just get high, play video games, and snowboard with his friends than ever even think about taking the GED. I imagine all the problems he's had in school over the past have really made him hate learning. Ugh, I'm a horrible parent for not sticking up for him sooner. He hates school more than anything. It has become a great source of stress&anxiety for him.

He does not have an IEP, but he would if I had had him tested when he was younger. He has ADHD and struggles so much with being able to pay attention and comprehend the material. School is so wicked boring to him. And I really don't blame him. The bad thing is I had no problem with school, so I thought he was just being defiant and lazy. Now I've seen he has developed those coping mechanisms because all through school he's had teachers pestering him about not achieving and he just doesn't want to deal with people being on his back all the time.

I will definitely see what I can find as far as an alternate education. I'm not making him stay in school just because society says that's what you need to do. I just want to help him find what he's really interested in doing. Because right now it's pretty much nothing

[lisafromjackson]

There is a process we talk about sometimes called "deschooling" or "school detox." Often it takes awhile to get rid of the aversion kids develop to "learning" because they see it as something school does to you. It's worth it to read up on that a bit because it sounds like it is likely to be a process he will have to go through. He needs an environment that recognizes where he is right now, and allows him to work through stuff as he figures out what he wants to do/learn. It takes patience, but I think the best thing to do is stop thinking about the "timetable for learning" imposed by school. However, with patience and support for both of you, it really can turn around.

What part of the country are you in? There may well be good healthy alternatives available to you.

[eerie138]

this deschooling sounds like exactly the kind if thing he needs. I'm afraid if I simply let him drop out in the hopes that he will obtain his GED then he will never feel the need to do anything.

we live in ohio; I'm not sure how to find these alternatives to school....

[James Comey]

At this point, I would agree de-schooling would probably be the best route, as lisa suggested.

A warning: it can be very hard for someone to re-kindle their interest in life after constantly suffering from extensive boredom, and your son could possibly slip into a depression. It's important to keep a semblance of structure and perhaps people in his life. Therapists are a different can of worms, though.

[eerie138]

I agree with you and Lisa about deschooling. thanks for the warning about the repercussions. I will keep an eye on him. now I just need to figure out how to go about doing this ?

[Alistoriv]

(01-09-2015 05:53 AM)Missile Wrote:  Your son may be having sucididal thoughts
I know this from personal experience with my cousin

god don't sugarcoat it missle

[eerie138]

haha well missile f

---

haha well missile does have a point, ugly though it may seem

[James Comey]

eerie138: this may be of use:
http://www.amazon.com/Deschooling-Gently...0615208770

[xcriteria]

I hated school, too, and I finally learned about the GED when I was 16, and persuaded my parents to let me drop out as a junior (mid-year), get a GED, and start college the following year. Dropping out was exactly what I needed. College was better, and I did well there the first year, though I ended up questioning college as well -- long story!

But, it sounds like school isn't helping your son. I wouldn't even focus on the GED as the main goal. Getting one may be useful for him, but you typically have to drop out first anyway, and there's no timeframe on getting one. Some jobs require or prefer a GED, and it's often a stop for dropouts to get into college, but it can wait.

The bigger question is how he can recover his capacity to learn, discover or rekindle some interests, explore the world outside of school, and consider what he'd like to do with his future.

One thing that may be useful is if he can talk to some people who can help him with all that. De-schooling can take the form of just eliminating school and giving someone time and space, but connecting with people who have made the journey to varying degrees can be useful as well. I think a number of us would be happy to talk to him, including on a Google Hangout, Skype call, or text chat if he's open to it.

It's worth noting that video games, snowboarding, and all kinds of things can be pathways to learning. Learning about the damaging impacts of school-as-usual on motivation can also help, and about the path many unschoolers take as they de-school -- as others have mentioned above.

Many of the students on here have parents who are really stuck in "school is what matters" and "grades are your main priority" kinds of thinking, no matter how miserable their kids are. Mine were like that too, though it could have been worse. One of the projects some of us are working on is figuring out how to help parents see things from another perspective... and help young people figure out a path from struggling with the impacts of school, to finding their way in life.

Anyway, thanks for posting, and we're here to help in any way we can!

[SoulRiser]

Quote:I have a question for you: how old are you and what's your story?

Not sure if this question was for me, but I'm 32 now, and I started this site when I was 16, in a private school. The school started out really small, and the students got to vote on all the rules and stuff, but after a year or so the teachers decided they didn't like our choices and they stopped letting us decide things. It all went downhill from there, and I made SS as a place for me to vent.

Quote:Like he would rather just get high, play video games, and snowboard with his friends than ever even think about taking the GED.

That's totally understandable. After being burned out, it takes some time to recover and get motivation back again.

Quote:I just want to help him find what he's really interested in doing. Because right now it's pretty much nothing

Be careful with this though... while it's easy to see getting high as 'nothing' - video games, snowboarding and friends can all be very valuable things. Don't degrade what little interests he has left by calling them "nothing".

Deschooling will take time, and don't pressure him into doing anything, or de-value what he does decide to do.

We'd be happy to have him here, though, if he wants to join.

[eerie138]

(01-10-2015 10:05 AM)Hansgrohe Wrote:  eerie138: this may be of use:
http://www.amazon.com/Deschooling-Gently...0615208770

Thanks Hansgrohe! I will definitely check this out

[eerie138]

(01-10-2015 10:11 AM)xcriteria Wrote:  I hated school, too, and I finally learned about the GED when I was 16, and persuaded my parents to let me drop out as a junior (mid-year), get a GED, and start college the following year. Dropping out was exactly what I needed. College was better, and I did well there the first year, though I ended up questioning college as well -- long story!

But, it sounds like school isn't helping your son. I wouldn't even focus on the GED as the main goal. Getting one may be useful for him, but you typically have to drop out first anyway, and there's no timeframe on getting one. Some jobs require or prefer a GED, and it's often a stop for dropouts to get into college, but it can wait.

The bigger question is how he can recover his capacity to learn, discover or rekindle some interests, explore the world outside of school, and consider what he'd like to do with his future.

One thing that may be useful is if he can talk to some people who can help him with all that. De-schooling can take the form of just eliminating school and giving someone time and space, but connecting with people who have made the journey to varying degrees can be useful as well. I think a number of us would be happy to talk to him, including on a Google Hangout, Skype call, or text chat if he's open to it.

It's worth noting that video games, snowboarding, and all kinds of things can be pathways to learning. Learning about the damaging impacts of school-as-usual on motivation can also help, and about the path many unschoolers take as they de-school -- as others have mentioned above.

Many of the students on here have parents who are really stuck in "school is what matters" and "grades are your main priority" kinds of thinking, no matter how miserable their kids are. Mine were like that too, though it could have been worse. One of the projects some of us are working on is figuring out how to help parents see things from another perspective... and help young people figure out a path from struggling with the impacts of school, to finding their way in life.

Anyway, thanks for posting, and we're here to help in any way we can!

xcriteria I have to agree that school isn't helping my son, unless the goal is to make him question everything he thinks and believes. He's learned from school that if you're not 'smart', then you're pretty much a waste of space and you'll never amount to anything.

So given your experience, do you believe that if I just allow him to chill for a bit and decompress (or de-school) he'll be more apt to talk to someone about how he truly feels? He's a mess. He tries to cover up his emotions with a false bravado and skewed egoism that really only translates into getting himself into trouble.

I think video games and snowboarding are fantastic for him. They are things that he feels very positive about because he's good at them. I encourage him to do these things whenever he can. The thing that concerns me is the pot. I mean it's not the worst thing in the world to get high. it scares me a little for him because he uses it as a crutch to avoid doing things, thinking about things, talking about things. I think it's actually quite a good practice at times, but I don't want to watch him become like so many people I've seen just sink into a pit of self-loathing and never find those things that interest them and make them feel like they deserve to have a future. I mean it doesn't matter what he chooses to do as long as he feels fulfilled in life. if not that, then wth is the point?

As for what you said about helping parents see things from another perspective, I would love to help. I wish someone had suggested these things to me many years ago so my son wouldn't have suffered so much. I feel crippled by the fact that I had just as much a part in tearing him down as the school system did. But, it's not out of guilt that I want to change myself and try to help other parents see that there are different options for their kids. It's because I don't want to continue destroying my son like my parents, teachers, and other adults destroyed me.

Thanks for your advice. it really means a lot to me. and I hope that my son will one day find his way to this place because he could use the support of kids and adults who have experienced similar things. For now, he trusts no one. I think it will take some time. Of course, I did tell him that this is where I finally realized how much I was listening to what he said without truly hearing what he was saying

[eerie138]

(01-10-2015 10:47 PM)SoulRiser Wrote:  

Quote:I have a question for you: how old are you and what's your story?

Not sure if this question was for me, but I'm 32 now, and I started this site when I was 16, in a private school. The school started out really small, and the students got to vote on all the rules and stuff, but after a year or so the teachers decided they didn't like our choices and they stopped letting us decide things. It all went downhill from there, and I made SS as a place for me to vent.

Yea it was for you, but I am not very tech savvy I've never ever posted anywhere before, so even with instructions I'm really lost. Thanks for sharing about yourself. Its good to know that there's some one out there who has been through this and is willing to listen. My son will need that when he's ready for it

Quote:Like he would rather just get high, play video games, and snowboard with his friends than ever even think about taking the GED.

That's totally understandable. After being burned out, it takes some time to recover and get motivation back again.

I do agree with this! He is so sad when he's not doing things that he feels really positive about. I hope that he will be able to find that inspiration again. He's so very stressed and defensive all the time

Quote:I just want to help him find what he's really interested in doing. Because right now it's pretty much nothing

Be careful with this though... while it's easy to see getting high as 'nothing' - video games, snowboarding and friends can all be very valuable things. Don't degrade what little interests he has left by calling them "nothing".

Duly note....I misspoke. He's the one who said he's interested in nothing. But you make a good point. He's definitely interested in the video games and snowboarding. I encourage him to do these things with his friends as much as possible. And now that he's made the decision to go with de-schooling/unschooling he will have time to do this more and hopefully feel less tangled up inside. More able to figure out what he'd like to pursue.

Deschooling will take time, and don't pressure him into doing anything, or de-value what he does decide to do.

We'd be happy to have him here, though, if he wants to join.

I plan to give him the time he needs to find himself. He's very confused and panicked right now. I have told him about this place. Right now he's very reluctant to look at it, but I think he might come around. I think it would benefit him greatly