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To everyone who joined these forums at some point, and got discouraged by the negativity and left after a while (or even got literally scared off): I'm sorry.

I wasn't good enough at encouraging people to be kinder, and removing people who refuse to be kind. Encouraging people is hard, and removing people creates conflict, and I hate conflict... so that's why I wasn't better at it.

I was a very, very sensitive teen. The atmosphere of this forum as it is now, if it had existed in 1996, would probably have upset me far more than it would have helped.

I can handle quite a lot of negativity and even abuse now, but that isn't the point. I want to help people. I want to help the people who need it the most, and I want to help people like the 1996 version of me.

I'm still figuring out the best way to do that, but as it is now, these forums are doing more harm than good, and I can't keep running them.

Thank you to the few people who have tried to understand my point of view so far. I really, really appreciate you guys. You are beautiful people.

Everyone else: If after everything I've said so far, you still don't understand my motivations, I think it's unlikely that you will. We're just too different. Maybe someday in the future it might make sense, but until then, there's no point in arguing about it. I don't have the time or the energy for arguing anymore. I will focus my time and energy on people who support me, and those who need help.

-SoulRiser

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So I stood up..........sorta
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M3116 Offline
I and I

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Post: #1
So I stood up..........sorta

INB4 the school calls me a Jew and the fat slag asst. principal loves (eating) children. Don't feel like reading? Get out then. It's a free country. Biggrin Love you all.

I wanted to post about this sometime, but I'll do it now before I head back to...that place thinking about will only make me sad and sad again.

So it all started with a summons to the student attendance mediation one day in the mail. Administration wanted me to come to school 10 minutes early and attend this meeting for the whole day, but I told my mom and dad there was no way I was going to come and things like that were just about at my final break point. So, I didn't go, but my parents had to.

When I left school that day, my mom was picking me up. She told me I had to go into the district office with a parent and sign a form, and there was no option.

I know that I could have run. I know that. I went in, though.

When I got there the receptionist said five minutes. I was ready to turn to stone before anyone came, anyway, knowing the school, so it didn't matter. It didn't matter a damn thing to me, as a matter of fact.

But a mediator met me at the lobby pretty soon. He grabbed my hand and wasn't too keen on letting go. 'Do you really love New York?,' he asked me.

I should probably explain now that I really don't love New York. I only bought that sweatshirt, in fact, because I was cold as hell one day near Central Park waiting for someone to meet me, and there were all these touristy shops around.

Anyway, I just shook my head with this mongoloid look on my face. Sad as hell. See, I knew he just wanted to joke around. I KNEW that. But that's just the thing. The whole thing is nothing to laugh or smile at. Not even if you're trying to be nice.

So I followed him to his office and he asked me to sit down. But I wouldn't. I wouldn't so much as shake my head, either. For the first so minutes I said nothing at all. My mom sat down in a chair and told me to. But I only stood there, looking ahead.

This went on about seven minutes. He groveled and groveled, that I would sit down. I only looked him in the center of his eyes, not saying a word. At this moment I realize about the guy, he'll do this with you till time stops. He just looked right back at me, eyes gaping, staring right through me, not serious but not joking like at all.

I coolly let my eyes wander back into the fascinating spot in face. Which isn't entirely a lie, either, because I have about a million eye floaters and mine are these circular units of one bouncing through the air. They look just like atoms and air molecules, in fact. It helps me to understand chemistry better, in fact. I would bet they're about exactly what gas particles look like. Exactly. In fact I'm sure.

I interrupt this official mid-sentence as he is in the middle of another uncounted attempt to get me to sit in a chair. Which... I didn't do for the entire meeting anyway.

"Zimmerman threatened to subpoena me." It just came out. It just came the hell out.

That got things going. Of course, once I had started, I couldn't STOP or anything. About the whole situation. About my whole particular situation, and all. He just sat there and calmly stared, until about the point I said something along the lines of, '...handled the situation, mine-- and from what I have gathered, those of others-- in a way I believe to be highly inefficient; could be rude and disrespectful; instructed me to wait outside her office while making small talk with other teachers for, I counted, about fifteen minutes; appeared to have no knowledge of any prior absences or of my current status in school; lied about a fire drill and lied about having the qualifications to determine the status of the particular fire drill; gave me an ultimatum saying she would notify my guardian and then failed to do so...'

He started by saying how he called the school cop mister so-and-so, and was respectful to the school staff, and greeted me politely when I came in, and all. I knew where this was going. Like hell I did. I gave the guy a very bored sort of a glance.

"...So I would appreciate if you could say MRS. Zimmerman, don't just keep saying 'Zimmerman.'" He sat and watched, as if waiting for me to do a cartwheel or the hell knows what.

'I don't think I can do that.'

THAT, I-would-appreciate-if-you-would-call-her-by-her-full-name crap. THAT was his response to this. How I was SAYING the name. Not WHAT the hell I was saying. Of course, he didn't want a bad word about the precious and beautiful(yeah right) asst. principal.

I'd told him I, too, believed in granting respect to those who had earned it but that I was afraid I had lost all respect in the AP given the way my peers and I had been treated. I told him I was sorry the school had an office administration that felt as if they had to impose an absolutist and often improfessional control over their students.

And you know what he told me? He said she called me in because she CARES. He said this PARTICULAR slag, has got five kids and six grandchildren and that she loves children. That she comes in to work every day caring about the student body and conducting her job in a caring way for them. That he knows her PERSONALLY, in fact.

I stared back at him again like before, very amused.

And you know what else? I'm really not actually a child, I'm really not, I'm pretty sure I overlapped that title when I became capable of actually having one myself; and really not all children are exactly the same. So how the hell can you love all the children that go to high school? How the hell can you be a good principal when all you did was get fucked five times? I'd be interested to know. I really would. Maybe someone here can assist me in understanding that.

So when about he was done making a valid argument as to why I should rub the AP's buttcheeks in my face, I asked him why, then, she would make a false threat of a court summons.

And you know what he said? He said this really is not a false threat; the school really CAN try to seek a penalty in court for a student's truancy. Like an option to press charges, I pointed out. I knew this. He nodded.

'Well, first of all,' I said. 'The handbook clearly states the process that the school goes about absences. I'm on the sixteenth, which, it says, is a referral to SAM. I SIGNED this contract. So clearly, you may have, but you were NOT going to subpoena me or any other similar student the VERY next offense. Is this correct?'

He just reverted back to saying he COULD have. So I asked him why the hell(not really, I never swore) that the school didn't take me to court already as promised so I had a due process to defend my actions?

I should explain this whole meeting was aimed toward 'teaching' me not to be sick one more time till May. Unless I had a doctor note. That was the only time.

I asked him what if I belonged to a state protected religious affiliation which did not believe in going to the doctor. I told him they told me I would have to take this issue further up to administration and that because of this they clearly did not have a professional handle on this basic legal matter of running a school the right way.

And then, he dares, 'What religion is that?'

No religion of mine. Obviously. Does that matter? There are multiple ones.

'I don't believe I have to tell you that.'

He tells me this, 'It seems like you're trying to find a way to use the system.'

That's when I wanna cry more than ever, but I just bite my lip and my eyes sort of cross like always. I wanted to cry every second of this. I wanted every moment of this to be under my covers safe from everything. The way the whole meeting was going I had wanted to cry more than anything it seemed at points. And I don't know why but I was blue as hell. But I didn't. I didn't cry at all. No matter how much I ever hated myself I wouldn't've done that to me.

He said HE tried to look at things in a thorough method and decide what he believed was fair from it. I said, 'I KNOOOW! Me too! That's what I try to do! That's what I tried to do! That's what I wanted to do! Before everything got all complicated. Before I couldn't any longer be right! That's what I wish I could still do! Before all I wanted to do was go to school and they threatened me with the law!' We had another staring moment.

Well, anyway, he said he commended me for doing 'so well' when I was there, and all. He kept saying I was keen or something. Like hell he thought that. He wanted me to like him! He wanted me to in turn like the school!! He wanted me to in turn start waking at the crack of dawn every damned day and pulling up my pants to my neck and walking to school and whistling about how the ants go marching two by two, unable to control my excitement going to class!!!

I then asked him WHY. Why the hell are you so adamant on the whole thing? Again, I didn't swear. I told him I needed my days off too you know.

He said, in a voice like a prayer, THAT WE CAN'T TEACH AN EMPTY SEAT. He showed one from a pile of about a hundred of these dumb laminated papers of an empty seat with that phrase. He gave it to me. He said I could have it, too. I returned it to the pile. I told him I learn more out of school than in. I told him school teaches me almost nothing.

You know what he thought of that? He said that he thought that was great. Fuck that.

I told him that clearly my education was not the concern. I told him I would like to know how much per day my absence supposedly cost and that my parents would be willing to make a donation to the school on the terms that all of mine would be cleared and the board would somehow forget about me. My parents have money, too. Not to make like that makes me happy or anything, but they could, too. They could make a donation.

He said, to the latter no. But you know what else he said? Take your notes now. $44.50. $44.50 A DAY.

So I said if we're getting nowhere, why am I the exception? I asked him why I was the exception to effectiveness in preventing low achievement. My achievement sure wouldn't go up with all these 'truancy rehabilitation meetings.'

He did something he shouldn't've done. He talked about his son. He said HIS son was my age, 15 or so, (I must be a couple of years older, but whatever, it doesn't matter) and HE had a learning disability.

'I have a learning disability, too,' I said.

He said his son was very dyslexic and he was a good kid and all but he couldn't read. He asked me if I knew what he'd do to get his son to get the grades I did. He said he'd give an arm and another arm.

I did something only a fuck like me would do. Realize now that I'm so damned blue I can't think right. About anything. I said, 'Would you give up the district's absence policy?'


And he said absolutely.



Going safely back to the old thing I ask him what he'd do if, hypothetically though it wouldn't happen, there was a mandatory school session on Saturday, and there was a Seventh Day Adventist kid. What would he do? I mean what would he DO?

He said, 'Well, you know what I'd do?' He was thinking about the question. It was depressing me. 'I'd take him aside and see if maybe we could arrange for after school, Monday.' We had a staring moment.

The staring moments were good for me. I needed a pause. My lip was quivering like it never used to before. It was so hard, to talk.

I asked him how I was any different. He said, assuming I was a Jehovah's Witness,(I was thinking a sort of a Scientologist), like this one kid didn't have insurance, I could go see the nurse. He cut me a deal. I could go see the nurse and all if I felt sick. And if I was sick, she'd excuse me and I'd go home. The nurse isn't a half horrible human being. The thing is when I get a fever it's not the type of thing that shows up on a thermometer......

I knew I wouldn't 'win.' I knew it. And you know what else? He told me he bet it was hard for me to get up every day and face high school. He bet it was a scary place for me. He said it would take a lot of inner strength for me to get through it, and when I did, it would never come back again. He said I would have to envision everything it would take to make high school a place I wanted to go and try to do what i could to make that a reality. When I say I wanted to cry, this is mainly it. Because it's true a little. Again I'm just the douchebag who walks away alone when it's all over. Cause I don't have friends, and all. Mainly he mean that, probably. Coulda died. Didn't. Just ignored him.

I said what if I told you that you were going to a concentration camp and that you'd better make the best of it. Would it be your responsibility to reverse the displeasure of a displeasing circumstance?

He said, 'Well I'd think, I hope I don't go to a concentration camp.' He went off about how his old buddies' grandparents had gone in for being Japanese and all. He said he bet I had relatives who too went to camps for being Jewish. 'Nooo,' I said. 'No. No. I don't.'

I wish I had a nickel for every time someone thinks I'm Jewish. Reason I make the comparison so often, I just think it's the worse outcome of government that can happen to human beings is all, ever--one that everyone KNOWS about and could relate to. I'm not, though. I'm American if you wanted to know, and my parents are both Irish, and I'm quite agnostic, nothing Jewish about me at all. People always think I'm Jewish.

Anyway, it went on. I said I might as well drop out of school. Or take the High School Proficiency Examination and be done with it, and all. He said he hoped I didn't. He ASKED my mom to make sure I didn't. Then he made me sign THE FORM.

I pulled out my left hand(which is a defective move either way, because I've been ambidextrous ever since I was little but the school has conditioned me endlessly enough to make my left slightly more clumsy than my right) and scribbled my name illegibly. I said if it came back to haunt me I'd just disenroll.

He laughed and said he KNEW I was left handed. That he'd been sitting here the whole time thinking how left handed I was. Because he reminded me of someone, and all. Whatever. He was having a grand old time.

I thanked him and I left.

I was still standing up.
02-14-2012 02:13 PM
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SaintVicious Offline
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Post: #2
RE: So I stood up..........sorta

inb4 didnt read lol
02-14-2012 03:33 PM
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M3116 Offline
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RE: So I stood up..........sorta

Cute. Smile
02-14-2012 03:37 PM
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Absnt Offline
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RE: So I stood up..........sorta

What was this whole thing about? I read it and all, but what was the form about? And who the hell was that guy lol?

Blog I post to now:
http://blog.darknedgy.net

Edfreedom.org -- An organization for more freedom in education.
http://www.edfreedom.org/join-us/
02-14-2012 03:53 PM
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M3116 Offline
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RE: So I stood up..........sorta

Just saying I wouldn't be absent until May. The whole deal. They sent him to go and get me to sign it. I sure as hell wasn't going to just LISTEN about how important school is, though. Partly because of you guys. You can laugh all you want. It's just this whole thing has given me some new-found hope for school. I told the administrator as he was trying to get me to sign it, 'Did you ever think half of the time SCHOOL has to adapt to the everchanging needs of its STUDENTS rather than vice versa? Did you ever think that the fact that over one hundred thousand students exceeded the absence limit in 2000 means you need to adapt your methods of educating them, either by year round school or effectively lightening school and all that comes with it, instead of using fear tactics to correct this behavior? Did that ever occur?'(after he said the absence rate was reduced 2/3 from the year 2000) And in that small moment, he said we never thought of that, and then I almost felt a small glimmer of hope... That's mainly why I wanted to let the SS know. Just that you can try, at least. It doesn't hurt to try.
02-14-2012 04:35 PM
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OasisxPoisonxProdigy Offline
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Post: #6
RE: So I stood up..........sorta

dude I totally understand, my math teacher gives me hope that school can change. He such a good teacher, I can learn from him much better from the witch I had before. That witch totally hated me, and thought I was bad at math. In Trig b right now, actually starting calculus this month with private tutor. Part of the reasons why my math grades were so shitty (only c's) until now was that I really didn't give a fuck about math and thought it was boring. I can kind of enjoy math because I can understand, and I can understand it because I enjoy it. Also I think you were actually pretty brave because of those idle threats and those arguments. I'm actually glad there are school administrations who actually listen to students.
02-14-2012 05:20 PM
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M3116 Offline
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RE: So I stood up..........sorta

OMG I know right. Half the time math teachers are only peeking out from some book and going through the motions of all these different formulas. "Then you do this, and then this, and look what you're left with." Half the time you don't really get the chance to comprehend the whole meaning behind math and formulas, and all. I'm glad you got a good one though, this time. Congrats. It pretty much goes to show potential is potential and sometimes teachers ARES ones to blame.
Thanks man. Yeah he said I could pop in and rant whenever I wanted. I'd like to see actual change but meh.
02-14-2012 07:35 PM
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The Offline
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RE: So I stood up..........sorta

[Image: downloader.php]

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(This post was last modified: 02-15-2012 11:17 AM by The.)
02-14-2012 08:30 PM
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Post: #9
RE: So I stood up..........sorta

Sorry....

[Image: berneydidnotread.gif?1318992465]

Balls of Steel:
Hidden stuff:
(01-13-2012 10:37 AM)UnschoolShqiponjë Wrote:  Mike you deserve an SS medal. Here, be proud:
[Image: BallsofSteel2.png]
Congrats for doing something I never had the balls to do.
If you have kids, save them from the bullshit you are forced to go through.
(01-25-2012 05:36 AM)UnschoolShqiponjë Wrote:  Balls of steel re-awarded. 
(02-07-2012 03:22 PM)flann Wrote:  Balls of Tungsten, now.

I found a picture for tungsten balls
http://bit.ly/xqd1zk

(02-14-2012 03:17 PM)Maelstrom Wrote:  Your balls are denser than white dwarf star matter.
(03-13-2012 08:27 PM)M3116 Wrote:  Balls of steel re-re-reawarded Nutter

(05-14-2013 03:01 PM)Prince Darkstar Wrote:  Dirtbikemike is the only guy I know of on here who won an argument with a teacher.
02-15-2012 09:50 AM
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Miller0700 Offline
Here to save you.

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RE: So I stood up..........sorta

tl;dr

Previously known as Derchin.
02-15-2012 09:56 AM
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aCol Offline
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RE: So I stood up..........sorta

Could you please sum it up - I am not in the mood for long texts Biggrin

Btw, the whole MRS. stuff is familiar. There was this teacher in one of these filling lessons when a teacher gets sick, and she'd bitch around about how I'd sit. So I said "Normally, I'd do what you want. But considering how unfriendly you where, I won''t". She then wanted me to see the principal - I refused ("You have a problem with me. Look, I won't help you. I won't support you punishing me. You can go to the principal. Fine with me. But don't try to drag me with you."). He came down, we had a short talk, then started to discuss a bit in English, which was funny cause that teacher didn't speak English and came to the conclusion "So there is no problem".
She was like "This will go on later". It never did.

Don't fear to stand up for your rights, even though you might never have had them in the first place ... rights always were the reward of a successful fight.

RIP GORE GOROTH

RIP GORE GOROTH

RIP GORE GOROTH
02-16-2012 09:07 AM
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M3116 Offline
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RE: So I stood up..........sorta

(02-16-2012 09:07 AM)aCol Wrote:  Could you please sum it up - I am not in the mood for long texts Biggrin

Btw, the whole MRS. stuff is familiar. There was this teacher in one of these filling lessons when a teacher gets sick, and she'd bitch around about how I'd sit. So I said "Normally, I'd do what you want. But considering how unfriendly you where, I won''t". She then wanted me to see the principal - I refused ("You have a problem with me. Look, I won't help you. I won't support you punishing me. You can go to the principal. Fine with me. But don't try to drag me with you."). He came down, we had a short talk, then started to discuss a bit in English, which was funny cause that teacher didn't speak English and came to the conclusion "So there is no problem".
She was like "This will go on later". It never did.

Don't fear to stand up for your rights, even though you might never have had them in the first place ... rights always were the reward of a successful fight.

Can't really sum it up sorry, it was a long conversation and we talked about almost everything relating to school. Half the stuff I forgot to add too.
But you...are extremely awesome for doing that :O I mean half the time, it's not what you say. It's the way that you do it. If you're actually serious about something going on that was unfair, you'll probably win in a system that even attempts to pretend like it's fair. Too many times teachers try to get away with things because of fallacies in their own temperaments or way of responding to things. So, I agree with you. Even though I'm just learning to do that myself. Biggrin
02-16-2012 09:57 PM
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RammsteinFearFactory Offline
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RE: So I stood up..........sorta

(02-14-2012 08:30 PM)The Wrote:  [Image: downloader.php]

(02-15-2012 09:50 AM)Dirtbikemike Wrote:  Sorry....

[Image: berneydidnotread.gif?1318992465]

(02-15-2012 09:56 AM)Derchin Wrote:  tl;dr

[Image: troll_face_in_640_10.jpg]

I read the whole thing. You seemed to be very scared, but I thought all he was doing was make you sign a thing so you aren't absent until May?

[Image: adhd_mild.gif]
02-17-2012 12:33 AM
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UltraRobot Offline
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RE: So I stood up..........sorta

[Image: didnt-read-lol-chicken-gif.gif]

[Image: gPE89.gif]

[Image: DeusExTestSign.jpg]

"Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds. The mediocre mind is incapable of understanding the man who refuses to bow blindly to conventional prejudices and chooses instead to express his opinions courageously and honestly." - Albert Einstein

"Within a few years a simple and inexpensive device, readily carried about, will enable one to receive on land or sea the principal news, to hear a speech, a lecture, a song or play of a musical instrument, conveyed from any other region of the globe." - Nikola Tesla
(This post was last modified: 02-17-2012 07:50 AM by UltraRobot.)
02-17-2012 07:14 AM
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M3116 Offline
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RE: So I stood up..........sorta

(02-17-2012 12:33 AM)Waterlootube97 Wrote:  
(02-14-2012 08:30 PM)The Wrote:  [Image: downloader.php]

(02-15-2012 09:50 AM)Dirtbikemike Wrote:  Sorry....

[Image: berneydidnotread.gif?1318992465]

(02-15-2012 09:56 AM)Derchin Wrote:  tl;dr

[Image: troll_face_in_640_10.jpg]

I read the whole thing. You seemed to be very scared, but I thought all he was doing was make you sign a thing so you aren't absent until May?


Yeah, well, sorta... I might have added the fact that old fat slag AP told me, if I had any buts about what they were going to do to me the next time I was absent, I'd have to talk to administration about it, and they were sending a member of the district to get it 'sorted out.' (Yeah right. Sorted out) That's the thing, too. SAM claims to be neutral, but they're very obviously pro-school.
02-18-2012 10:06 AM
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OasisxPoisonxProdigy Offline
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RE: So I stood up..........sorta

(02-14-2012 07:35 PM)M3116 Wrote:  OMG I know right. Half the time math teachers are only peeking out from some book and going through the motions of all these different formulas. "Then you do this, and then this, and look what you're left with." Half the time you don't really get the chance to comprehend the whole meaning behind math and formulas, and all. I'm glad you got a good one though, this time. Congrats. It pretty much goes to show potential is potential and sometimes teachers ARES ones to blame.
Thanks man. Yeah he said I could pop in and rant whenever I wanted. I'd like to see actual change but meh.
All of our good administrators are retiring this year because of the budget cuts fucking with their health, we'll be left with principle that everyone hates and that guy that we don't even know what he does. My music teacher says we will lose somewhere between 6 to 13 teachers, which really sucks because the crappy teachers that fucks with everyone are in the clear because they've been there forever.
02-18-2012 11:58 AM
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fish20 Offline
Penguins are birds

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Post: #17
RE: So I stood up..........sorta

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02-22-2012 12:16 AM
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