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The School Survival Forums are permanently retired. If you need help with quitting school, unsupportive parents or anything else, there is a list of resources on the Help Page.

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To everyone who joined these forums at some point, and got discouraged by the negativity and left after a while (or even got literally scared off): I'm sorry.

I wasn't good enough at encouraging people to be kinder, and removing people who refuse to be kind. Encouraging people is hard, and removing people creates conflict, and I hate conflict... so that's why I wasn't better at it.

I was a very, very sensitive teen. The atmosphere of this forum as it is now, if it had existed in 1996, would probably have upset me far more than it would have helped.

I can handle quite a lot of negativity and even abuse now, but that isn't the point. I want to help people. I want to help the people who need it the most, and I want to help people like the 1996 version of me.

I'm still figuring out the best way to do that, but as it is now, these forums are doing more harm than good, and I can't keep running them.

Thank you to the few people who have tried to understand my point of view so far. I really, really appreciate you guys. You are beautiful people.

Everyone else: If after everything I've said so far, you still don't understand my motivations, I think it's unlikely that you will. We're just too different. Maybe someday in the future it might make sense, but until then, there's no point in arguing about it. I don't have the time or the energy for arguing anymore. I will focus my time and energy on people who support me, and those who need help.

-SoulRiser

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Enough is Enough
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returnal Away
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Post: #31
Re: Enough is Enough

Killjoy Wrote:
Newtown Wrote:Yup, sounds like a failsafe to me, eh?[/url]

There have always been insane people. In every school shooting case, there are drugs, poor parenting, and a multitude of other things involved. If these monsters weren't shooting up schools they'd be shooting up libraries.
So shitty schools had nothing to do with it? (But it's not like they had everything to do with it.)

woah dude
dude woah
05-02-2009 10:03 AM
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Sociopath Offline
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Post: #32
Re: Enough is Enough

Killjoy Wrote:
Newtown Wrote:Yup, sounds like a failsafe to me, eh?[/url]

There have always been insane people. In every school shooting case, there are drugs, poor parenting, and a multitude of other things involved. If these monsters weren't shooting up schools they'd be shooting up libraries.

BobManPerson Wrote:Killjoy: so you're saying that forcing someone to do something against their own will and violating their rights and giving them inhumane amounts of stress is okay as long as they say that it's all good for you?

In that case, how would you like it if I forced you into a box and kept you in there, and you couldn't do anything to defend yourself? I'd say it was to make you a better person. Does that mean it's okay?

The obvious difference is that those who ask you to stay in school are actually looking out for you. School is not a cardboard box, mate. Education is not a human rights violation; it's a human rights imperative.
We dont want it and we shouldnt be forced to go, even if that makes us "uneducated" we dont care

Hidden stuff:
TRIGGER WARNING: THIS TRIGGER WARNING CONTAINS TRIGGER WARNINGS!

Dear Tumblrites: Despite your wrongly self-diagnosed PTSD, no line of scientific evidence suggests people can be triggered over the internet. Triggering works through the senses (i.e. smell, taste, touch, vision, hearing.) but it goes through real time; if you're not experiencing it in real life as it's ACTUALLY HAPPENING in your ACTUAL life, you CANNOT be triggered. The only exception to this is if you have a seizure, but then again, that's triggered by epilepsy (i.e. rapidly-changing flashing lights) NOT PTSD. Remembering a bad incident is NOT the same thing as having a flashback. When you remember, you think; when you flashback, you feel.

#HashTagsAreForIdiots

[Image: violator_blackbg_110x32.gif]
Max Stirnir Wrote:"In the time of spirits thoughts grew till they overtopped my head, whose offspring they yet were; they hovered about me and convulsed me like fever-phantasies -- an awful power. The thoughts had become corporeal on their own account, were ghosts, e. g. God, Emperor, Pope, Fatherland, etc. If I destroy their corporeity, then I take them back into mine, and say: "I alone am corporeal." And now I take the world as what it is to me, as mine, as my property; I refer all to myself." The Ego and Its Own, pg. 15
Charles Manson Wrote:“Look down at me and you see a fool;
look up at me and you see a god;
look straight at me and you see yourself”
HeartofShadows Wrote:"Life is nothing more than a druggie trying to get their quick fix of happiness while dealing with the harsh withdrawal of reality"
Osip Mandelstam Wrote:"I divide all of world literature into authorized and unauthorized works. The former are all trash; the latter--stolen air. I want to spit in the face of every writer who first obtains permission and then writes." The Fourth Prose, 1930.
Lukas Foss Wrote:That is why the analogy of stealing does not work. With a thief, we want to know how much money he stole, and from whom. With the artist it is not how much he took and from whom, but what he did with it.
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05-02-2009 10:04 AM
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returnal Away
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Post: #33
Re: Enough is Enough

Killjoy Wrote:
Newtown Wrote:Yup, sounds like a failsafe to me, eh?[/url]

There have always been insane people. In every school shooting case, there are drugs, poor parenting, and a multitude of other things involved. If these monsters weren't shooting up schools they'd be shooting up libraries.

BobManPerson Wrote:Killjoy: so you're saying that forcing someone to do something against their own will and violating their rights and giving them inhumane amounts of stress is okay as long as they say that it's all good for you?

In that case, how would you like it if I forced you into a box and kept you in there, and you couldn't do anything to defend yourself? I'd say it was to make you a better person. Does that mean it's okay?

The obvious difference is that those who ask you to stay in school are actually looking out for you. School is not a cardboard box, mate. Education is not a human rights violation; it's a human rights imperative.
We aren't against education.

woah dude
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05-02-2009 10:05 AM
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mrtuesday Offline
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Post: #34
Re: Enough is Enough

Newtown Wrote:We aren't against education.

Indeed. Well, most of you aren't at least.

The glaring flaw in that method of thinking is the belief that memorization is inherently useless. How many people could learn Calculus without memorizing the coordinate system, or the Quadratic Formula, or how to Factor, or even how to solve an inequality? How many people could become writers without memorizing the basic tenets of their language's grammar? The fact is that memorization is the precursor to true learning. It may be an unfortunate truth, but it's a truth nonetheless.

Foremost, schools are about learning. They are the first and last remaining bastions of knowledge in our society and must be respected as such.
05-02-2009 10:11 AM
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Sociopath Offline
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Post: #35
Re: Enough is Enough

Killjoy Wrote:
Newtown Wrote:We aren't against education.

Indeed. Well, most of you aren't at least.

The glaring flaw in that method of thinking is the belief that memorization is inherently useless. How many people could learn Calculus without memorizing the coordinate system, or the Quadratic Formula, or how to Factor, or even how to solve an inequality? How many people could become writers without memorizing the basic tenets of their language's grammar? The fact is that memorization is the precursor to true learning. It may be an unfortunate truth, but it's a truth nonetheless.
ive got good news and bad new:
Bad news: your a Failure
Good News: theres a site just FULL of Failures, JUST LIKE YOU, they're just waiting to cry, complain and grovel, and do all sorts of fun, meaningless crap

its all HERE! - www.4chan.org

Hidden stuff:
TRIGGER WARNING: THIS TRIGGER WARNING CONTAINS TRIGGER WARNINGS!

Dear Tumblrites: Despite your wrongly self-diagnosed PTSD, no line of scientific evidence suggests people can be triggered over the internet. Triggering works through the senses (i.e. smell, taste, touch, vision, hearing.) but it goes through real time; if you're not experiencing it in real life as it's ACTUALLY HAPPENING in your ACTUAL life, you CANNOT be triggered. The only exception to this is if you have a seizure, but then again, that's triggered by epilepsy (i.e. rapidly-changing flashing lights) NOT PTSD. Remembering a bad incident is NOT the same thing as having a flashback. When you remember, you think; when you flashback, you feel.

#HashTagsAreForIdiots

[Image: violator_blackbg_110x32.gif]
Max Stirnir Wrote:"In the time of spirits thoughts grew till they overtopped my head, whose offspring they yet were; they hovered about me and convulsed me like fever-phantasies -- an awful power. The thoughts had become corporeal on their own account, were ghosts, e. g. God, Emperor, Pope, Fatherland, etc. If I destroy their corporeity, then I take them back into mine, and say: "I alone am corporeal." And now I take the world as what it is to me, as mine, as my property; I refer all to myself." The Ego and Its Own, pg. 15
Charles Manson Wrote:“Look down at me and you see a fool;
look up at me and you see a god;
look straight at me and you see yourself”
HeartofShadows Wrote:"Life is nothing more than a druggie trying to get their quick fix of happiness while dealing with the harsh withdrawal of reality"
Osip Mandelstam Wrote:"I divide all of world literature into authorized and unauthorized works. The former are all trash; the latter--stolen air. I want to spit in the face of every writer who first obtains permission and then writes." The Fourth Prose, 1930.
Lukas Foss Wrote:That is why the analogy of stealing does not work. With a thief, we want to know how much money he stole, and from whom. With the artist it is not how much he took and from whom, but what he did with it.
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05-02-2009 10:14 AM
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returnal Away
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Post: #36
Re: Enough is Enough

Killjoy Wrote:
Newtown Wrote:We aren't against education.

Indeed. Well, most of you aren't at least.

The glaring flaw in that method of thinking is the belief that memorization is inherently useless. How many people could learn Calculus without memorizing the coordinate system, or the Quadratic Formula, or how to Factor, or even how to solve an inequality? How many people could become writers without memorizing the basic tenets of their language's grammar? The fact is that memorization is the precursor to true learning. It may be an unfortunate truth, but it's a truth nonetheless.
The problem is that the whole system of learning in public schools is based on memorization. There's nothing wrong with memorization at first, but it's flawed when you base a whole style of education around it.

woah dude
dude woah
05-02-2009 10:16 AM
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mrtuesday Offline
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Post: #37
Re: Enough is Enough

TrueAnarchist Wrote:[inane drivel]

Mate, please stop talking and let the grownups get back to business. Pinky swear?

Newtown Wrote:The problem is that the whole system of learning in public schools is based on memorization. There's nothing wrong with memorization at first, but it's flawed when you base a whole style of education around it.

Teachers are breaking up the old standby of rote, flash-card memorization. I've seen this trend pop up in numerous schools as of late. Using games, mnemonic devices, etc. It's not a problem any more. It seems that school is based around memorization, but education itself is based around memorization. It's a symbiotic relationship; you can't have one without the other.
05-02-2009 10:16 AM
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Milk2Go Offline
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Post: #38
Re: Enough is Enough

First, put TrueAnarchist on your foes list like the rest of us have done. It's in your control panel.

Second, there's a reason kids today don't like learning: school gives learning such a bad name, people just don't have the will to learn anymore. I guarantee if you raised a child without society or the government interfering with his growth and development, he'd enjoy learning and would want to learn on his own.
05-02-2009 10:21 AM
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Sociopath Offline
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Post: #39
Re: Enough is Enough

Killjoy Wrote:
TrueAnarchist Wrote:[inane drivel]

Mate, please stop talking and let the grownups get back to business. Pinky swear?

Newtown Wrote:The problem is that the whole system of learning in public schools is based on memorization. There's nothing wrong with memorization at first, but it's flawed when you base a whole style of education around it.

Teachers are breaking up the old standby of rote, flash-card memorization. I've seen this trend pop up in numerous schools as of late. Using games, mnemonic devices, etc. It's not a problem any more. It seems that school is based around memorization, but education itself is based around memorization. It's a symbiotic relationship; you can't have one without the other.
douchebag

I WILL NOT BE IGNORED!

bmp, shut up

Hidden stuff:
TRIGGER WARNING: THIS TRIGGER WARNING CONTAINS TRIGGER WARNINGS!

Dear Tumblrites: Despite your wrongly self-diagnosed PTSD, no line of scientific evidence suggests people can be triggered over the internet. Triggering works through the senses (i.e. smell, taste, touch, vision, hearing.) but it goes through real time; if you're not experiencing it in real life as it's ACTUALLY HAPPENING in your ACTUAL life, you CANNOT be triggered. The only exception to this is if you have a seizure, but then again, that's triggered by epilepsy (i.e. rapidly-changing flashing lights) NOT PTSD. Remembering a bad incident is NOT the same thing as having a flashback. When you remember, you think; when you flashback, you feel.

#HashTagsAreForIdiots

[Image: violator_blackbg_110x32.gif]
Max Stirnir Wrote:"In the time of spirits thoughts grew till they overtopped my head, whose offspring they yet were; they hovered about me and convulsed me like fever-phantasies -- an awful power. The thoughts had become corporeal on their own account, were ghosts, e. g. God, Emperor, Pope, Fatherland, etc. If I destroy their corporeity, then I take them back into mine, and say: "I alone am corporeal." And now I take the world as what it is to me, as mine, as my property; I refer all to myself." The Ego and Its Own, pg. 15
Charles Manson Wrote:“Look down at me and you see a fool;
look up at me and you see a god;
look straight at me and you see yourself”
HeartofShadows Wrote:"Life is nothing more than a druggie trying to get their quick fix of happiness while dealing with the harsh withdrawal of reality"
Osip Mandelstam Wrote:"I divide all of world literature into authorized and unauthorized works. The former are all trash; the latter--stolen air. I want to spit in the face of every writer who first obtains permission and then writes." The Fourth Prose, 1930.
Lukas Foss Wrote:That is why the analogy of stealing does not work. With a thief, we want to know how much money he stole, and from whom. With the artist it is not how much he took and from whom, but what he did with it.
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05-02-2009 10:26 AM
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mrtuesday Offline
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Post: #40
Re: Enough is Enough

BobManPerson Wrote:First, put TrueAnarchist on your foes list like the rest of us have done. It's in your control panel.

FINALLY. Thank you.

BobManPerson Wrote:Second, there's a reason kids today don't like learning: school gives learning such a bad name, people just don't have the will to learn anymore. I guarantee if you raised a child without society or the government interfering with his growth and development, he'd enjoy learning and would want to learn on his own.

The problem is, our world today is entirely too complex. Kids need guidance in their studies, and school provides that in spades. It's not like children today just need to know how to hunt caribou and make a fire for their family to survive the drought season. Things just aren't that simple anymore.
05-02-2009 10:27 AM
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Sociopath Offline
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Post: #41
Re: Enough is Enough

Im surprised being as fat and floppy as ur grandpa after gettin sweaty fucking him can actually use the internet, but u STILL FAIL!!!

and this isnt 1994, no1 pinky swears, dumbass

Hidden stuff:
TRIGGER WARNING: THIS TRIGGER WARNING CONTAINS TRIGGER WARNINGS!

Dear Tumblrites: Despite your wrongly self-diagnosed PTSD, no line of scientific evidence suggests people can be triggered over the internet. Triggering works through the senses (i.e. smell, taste, touch, vision, hearing.) but it goes through real time; if you're not experiencing it in real life as it's ACTUALLY HAPPENING in your ACTUAL life, you CANNOT be triggered. The only exception to this is if you have a seizure, but then again, that's triggered by epilepsy (i.e. rapidly-changing flashing lights) NOT PTSD. Remembering a bad incident is NOT the same thing as having a flashback. When you remember, you think; when you flashback, you feel.

#HashTagsAreForIdiots

[Image: violator_blackbg_110x32.gif]
Max Stirnir Wrote:"In the time of spirits thoughts grew till they overtopped my head, whose offspring they yet were; they hovered about me and convulsed me like fever-phantasies -- an awful power. The thoughts had become corporeal on their own account, were ghosts, e. g. God, Emperor, Pope, Fatherland, etc. If I destroy their corporeity, then I take them back into mine, and say: "I alone am corporeal." And now I take the world as what it is to me, as mine, as my property; I refer all to myself." The Ego and Its Own, pg. 15
Charles Manson Wrote:“Look down at me and you see a fool;
look up at me and you see a god;
look straight at me and you see yourself”
HeartofShadows Wrote:"Life is nothing more than a druggie trying to get their quick fix of happiness while dealing with the harsh withdrawal of reality"
Osip Mandelstam Wrote:"I divide all of world literature into authorized and unauthorized works. The former are all trash; the latter--stolen air. I want to spit in the face of every writer who first obtains permission and then writes." The Fourth Prose, 1930.
Lukas Foss Wrote:That is why the analogy of stealing does not work. With a thief, we want to know how much money he stole, and from whom. With the artist it is not how much he took and from whom, but what he did with it.
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05-02-2009 10:32 AM
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returnal Away
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Post: #42
Re: Enough is Enough

Killjoy Wrote:The problem is, our world today is entirely too complex. Kids need guidance in their studies, and school provides that in spades. It's not like children today just need to know how to hunt caribou and make a fire for their family to survive the drought season. Things just aren't that simple anymore.
We've never said it's so simple at all. We're not really here to completely overhaul the "system"; we want to fix the many many bad spots that exist. But you've got to understand; school is not the only place where you can learn. I mean really, can school let you really learn at your own pace?

woah dude
dude woah
05-02-2009 10:34 AM
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mrtuesday Offline
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Post: #43
Re: Enough is Enough

Newtown Wrote:
Killjoy Wrote:The problem is, our world today is entirely too complex. Kids need guidance in their studies, and school provides that in spades. It's not like children today just need to know how to hunt caribou and make a fire for their family to survive the drought season. Things just aren't that simple anymore.
We've never said it's so simple at all. We're not really here to completely overhaul the "system"; we want to fix the many many bad spots that exist. But you've got to understand; school is not the only place where you can learn. I mean really, can school let you really learn at your own pace?

Of course not. But most people need the added, albeit artificial incentives presented by school to get into it at first. They just need the guidance, that's all.

I love libraries, hell I work at mine. There are always places to learn, school just brings these forces together.
05-02-2009 10:37 AM
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Sociopath Offline
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Post: #44
Re: Enough is Enough

Newtown Wrote:
Killjoy Wrote:The problem is, our world today is entirely too complex. Kids need guidance in their studies, and school provides that in spades. It's not like children today just need to know how to hunt caribou and make a fire for their family to survive the drought season. Things just aren't that simple anymore.
We've never said it's so simple at all. We're not really here to completely overhaul the "system"; we want to fix the many many bad spots that exist. But you've got to understand; school is not the only place where you can learn. I mean really, can school let you really learn at your own pace?
Actually, I am

Hidden stuff:
TRIGGER WARNING: THIS TRIGGER WARNING CONTAINS TRIGGER WARNINGS!

Dear Tumblrites: Despite your wrongly self-diagnosed PTSD, no line of scientific evidence suggests people can be triggered over the internet. Triggering works through the senses (i.e. smell, taste, touch, vision, hearing.) but it goes through real time; if you're not experiencing it in real life as it's ACTUALLY HAPPENING in your ACTUAL life, you CANNOT be triggered. The only exception to this is if you have a seizure, but then again, that's triggered by epilepsy (i.e. rapidly-changing flashing lights) NOT PTSD. Remembering a bad incident is NOT the same thing as having a flashback. When you remember, you think; when you flashback, you feel.

#HashTagsAreForIdiots

[Image: violator_blackbg_110x32.gif]
Max Stirnir Wrote:"In the time of spirits thoughts grew till they overtopped my head, whose offspring they yet were; they hovered about me and convulsed me like fever-phantasies -- an awful power. The thoughts had become corporeal on their own account, were ghosts, e. g. God, Emperor, Pope, Fatherland, etc. If I destroy their corporeity, then I take them back into mine, and say: "I alone am corporeal." And now I take the world as what it is to me, as mine, as my property; I refer all to myself." The Ego and Its Own, pg. 15
Charles Manson Wrote:“Look down at me and you see a fool;
look up at me and you see a god;
look straight at me and you see yourself”
HeartofShadows Wrote:"Life is nothing more than a druggie trying to get their quick fix of happiness while dealing with the harsh withdrawal of reality"
Osip Mandelstam Wrote:"I divide all of world literature into authorized and unauthorized works. The former are all trash; the latter--stolen air. I want to spit in the face of every writer who first obtains permission and then writes." The Fourth Prose, 1930.
Lukas Foss Wrote:That is why the analogy of stealing does not work. With a thief, we want to know how much money he stole, and from whom. With the artist it is not how much he took and from whom, but what he did with it.
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05-02-2009 10:37 AM
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Post: #45
Re: Enough is Enough

Killjoy Wrote:Calling the average school a human rights violation is ridiculous. I don't doubt for a second that there are exceptions and that some schools are indeed terrible places, but these anomalies do not grant you license to write off the entire institution. In the six schools I attended throughout my academic career, I saw none of the atrocities you all insist are so ubiquitous. None of the violence, none of the bullying, none of the "brainwashing." I just saw a bunch of people learning things in one place, being introduced to new concepts and ideas, and a great many of them excelling in areas of study they never even knew existed before.
As I said, you got lucky.

Quote:I appreciate that you aren't resorting to loaded terms, though.
Well, thank you. You have no idea how hard it is. Cool

Quote:
Quote:Look, I want things fixed just as much as you do. It's just that we disagree about what exactly is broken.

Quote:We have to respectfully disagree, but then you should be protesting about what goes on in the schools and not protesting the schools themselves as it seems this website promotes.
No no no, you're completely missing the point. If we went into school every day and sat in massage chairs while eating steak and hearing lectures from first-rate professors, I would not change my goals one bit. I oppose the school system for the same reason I would oppose a dictator, even a benevolent one: they simply have too much power. Students are expected to automatically and unquestioningly obey the teachers and school administrators and can be punished for things like dressing "wrong" and saying something "wrong" or eating something "wrong." Schools have absolute power over the students and I cannot morally turn a blind eye towards a system that operates that way. Students with a great teacher might get a terrible one next semester, and they won't be able to do shit about it. Schools can punish, search, question and detain students with no regard for legal process or the Constitution. We're at the mercy of the bureaucracy, and that's a sword hanging over our heads that I can't ignore.

Quote:I don't doubt for a second that you have had some terrible experiences, and I express my condolences to you. I just think that we're all going about this in the wrong way. If I may, what exactly happened to you?
Long story short, some guys got stressed out, I guess. Decided to take it out on me. Always outnumbered, always lost. Got stuff stolen and got beaten up for trying to get it back. After a while they just did it for fun, all the time, every day. I kind of went crazy I guess, couldn't sleep and had nightmares about shooting up the school. So they spread rumors that I was going to do it and everyone believed them, got scared of me and stayed away. Whenever I tried to fight back, teachers would threaten to detain/suspend me for fighting, so basically I was completely helpless. I started carrying a knife and was going to run away, but chickened out every time. My family made me go to a shrink because they thought I was becoming a terrorist. There's plenty more, but I don't really feel like telling it all.

Quote:It's just that this is one system that we don't need to change. Of all the things wrong with the world today, from the economic downturn to drug cartels and gang warfare, we shouldn't be picking fights with the good guys. The few aberrations in the education need to be dealt with, but not the education system as a whole.
They are not the good guys. They're not bad guys either, they just don't care because they don't have to care. There is no evil brainwashing conspiracy, it's just a natural political law: you help those who can vote for you. Students count for nothing, so there's no reason to listen to them. What we have now is a large section of the population with watered-down Constitutional rights, no say in the political process, who are "taught" without consent by the government. If that doesn't seem the least bit dangerous to you, then you scare me very much.

I think Buenaventura Durruti is a pretty cool guy. eh kills fascists and doesnt afraid of ruins.
The quickest way to kill a revolution is to wait for it.
05-02-2009 11:09 AM
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Trar Away
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Post: #46
Re: Enough is Enough

School only teaches you "OMG U NEED TO LISTEN TO US FOR YOUR OWN GOOD BECAUSE WE SAID SO AND IF YOU DON'T THEN WE WILL TAKE AWAY ONE OR MORE OF YOUR GOD-GIVEN RIGHTS AS A UNITED STATES CITIZEN THAT CHILDREN SHOULD HAVE BUT THEY DON'T BECAUSE OF BUREAUCRATIC ASSHOLES LIKE US LOL"

Okay, so I got carried away. The important thing is, while school is important in the early years to learn basic core important skills such as learning how to write and do 2 + 2, from grade 6 and onward it's getting so goddamn tedious and useless that i'd rather suck down a shotgun shell and DIE.
05-02-2009 11:28 AM
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mrtuesday Offline
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Post: #47
Re: Enough is Enough

Rebelnerd Wrote:No no no, you're completely missing the point. If we went into school every day and sat in massage chairs while eating steak and hearing lectures from first-rate professors, I would not change my goals one bit. I oppose the school system for the same reason I would oppose a dictator, even a benevolent one: they simply have too much power. Students are expected to automatically and unquestioningly obey the teachers and school administrators and can be punished for things like dressing "wrong" and saying something "wrong" or eating something "wrong." Schools have absolute power over the students and I cannot morally turn a blind eye towards a system that operates that way. Students with a great teacher might get a terrible one next semester, and they won't be able to do shit about it. Schools can punish, search, question and detain students with no regard for legal process or the Constitution. We're at the mercy of the bureaucracy, and that's a sword hanging over our heads that I can't ignore.

Look at State Board of Educ. v. Barnette. Children maintain their Constitutional Rights even while in school. If one's school happens to be unusually draconian, they can still opt for homeschooling or just change schools. Granted this is not always an option, but no one is putting a gun to your head.

This amounts to little more than paranoia. In every institution, people are asked to conform to a specific set of rules to procure not only their own well-being but that of others as well. There has to be a line drawn somewhere. If schools do anything they shouldn't, by all means publicize it. Take them to court; someone will take action. The prerequisite for a functional democracy is a well-informed populace, and school produces that in one way or another. Is that not ample reason to muster this amount of power?

Here's a quote from my High School's Code of Conduct.

Code of Conduct Wrote:Our mission is to educate all students to their highest level of academic potential and to teach them skills and knowledge to become capable, creative and responsible members of our society. Responsibility for learning must be shared by all - children, parents, teachers and community...

Those evil bastards.

Rebelnerd Wrote:Long story short, some guys got stressed out, I guess. Decided to take it out on me. Always outnumbered, always lost. Got stuff stolen and got beaten up for trying to get it back. After a while they just did it for fun, all the time, every day. I kind of went crazy I guess, couldn't sleep and had nightmares about shooting up the school. So they spread rumors that I was going to do it and everyone believed them, got scared of me and stayed away. Whenever I tried to fight back, teachers would threaten to detain/suspend me for fighting, so basically I was completely helpless. I started carrying a knife and was going to run away, but chickened out every time. My family made me go to a shrink because they thought I was becoming a terrorist. There's plenty more, but I don't really feel like telling it all.

In all seriousness, that's terrible. I'm at at loss for words.

Rebelnerd Wrote:They are not the good guys. They're not bad guys either, they just don't care because they don't have to care. There is no evil brainwashing conspiracy, it's just a natural political law: you help those who can vote for you. Students count for nothing, so there's no reason to listen to them. What we have now is a large section of the population with watered-down Constitutional rights, no say in the political process, who are "taught" without consent by the government. If that doesn't seem the least bit dangerous to you, then you scare me very much.

Alright, technically they're morally ambiguous but they're fighting for a good cause. The sad reality is that school needs to be compulsory because most people can not or would not teach themselves given the option.

Trar Wrote:Okay, so I got carried away. The important thing is, while school is important in the early years to learn basic core important skills such as learning how to write and do 2 + 2, from grade 6 and onward it's getting so goddamn tedious and useless that i'd rather suck down a shotgun shell and DIE.

Alright, let's see what is covered in grades six and onward. Here's an abbreviated list.

* Lands and peoples of the Eastern Hemisphere
* Prehistoric peoples
* Greek, Roman, and Middle Eastern civilizations
* The Middle Ages
* Renaissance and Reformation
* Scientific Revolution
* Age of Reason (Enlightenment)
* Industrial Age
* Yesterday and today around the world: Europe, the Middle East, Africa, Asia, Australia, and the Pacific
* World trade and resources
* Contemporary problems and issues
* Environment
* World geography
* Advanced map and globe skills
* Scientific classification
* The cell
* Heredity and genetics
* Effects of weather and climate
* Properties and uses of water
* Atmosphere
* Air pressure
* Rocks, soil, and minerals
* Ecology and environment
* Conservation
* Heat and temperature
* Laws of motion
* Energy
* Scientific method
* Laboratory techniques and safety
* Improving reading skills
* Literary terms
* Novels, short stories, plays
* Myths, legends, ballads
* Types of poetry
* Biography and autobiography
* Planning and producing dramatizations
* Speech activities
* Listening skills
* Refining dictionary skills
* Spelling
* Parts of speech
* Person, number, gender of nouns and pronouns
* Punctuation of conversation
* Clauses and phrases
* Compound sentences
* Writing descriptions, reports, journals, and letters
* Note taking and outlining
* Extending reference skills: atlases, directories, encyclopedias, periodicals, on-line information services, CD-ROMs, and other electronic reference material
* Library organization
* Good grooming and posture
* Dental health
* Healthy habits and lifestyles
* Exercise and fitness
* Effects of stimulants and narcotics
* Functions of the body
* Circulation and respiration
* Germ theory
* Sexually transmitted diseases
* Family life
* Toxins and antitoxins
* Antibiotics
* Immunization
* Chemotherapy
* Genetic disorders
* Personal and public safety
* Accident prevention
* Personality development
* Substance abuse
* Prime and composite numbers
* Square root
* Order of operations
* Absolute value
* Inequalities
* Numeration
* Properties of nonnegative integers
* Rational numbers and fractions
* Ratio, proportion, percent
* Finite, infinite, and empty sets
* Basic geometry concepts and terms
* Development and use of formulas
* Perimeter, circumference, area
* Metric and customary measurement
* Reading and constructing graphs
* Measures of central tendency: mean, mode, median, range
* Elementary business mathematics
* Use of calculators and computers
* Our African, Asian, and European backgrounds
* Exploration and discovery
* Growth and development of the United States
- Colonial life
- Struggle for independence
- U. S. Constitution and Bill of Rights
- Westward movement in America
- American Civil War
- Reconstruction
- U. S. as a world power
* Meaning of democracy
* Our American culture
* U. S. political system
* U. S. economic system
* U. S. government
* U. S. geography
* Advanced map and globe skills
* Scientific method
* Scientific nomenclature
* Scientific measurement
* Ecology and environment
* Conservation
* Composition of the earth
* Ocean, atmosphere
* Weather
* Water and its uses
* Weathering and erosion
* Recycling of resources
* Magnetism and electricity
* Heat and light
* Forces in liquids and gases
* Wave, mechanical, electrical, and nuclear energy
* The earth's movement
* Newton's three laws of motion
* Machines
* The atom
* Periodic table of elements
* Compounds and mixtures
* Chemical changes
* Astronomy
* The universe and Milky Way
* Space and space travel
* Independent reading
* Literal, inferential, and evaluative reading skills
* Literary terms
* Novel, short story, narrative poetry
* Nonfiction
* Biographies of great Americans
* American poets and storytellers
* Creative dramatics
* Listening and speech activities
* Advanced dictionary work
* Extended vocabulary
* Figures of speech
* Spelling
* Infinitive, participle, gerund, predicate nominative, predicate adjective, direct and indirect object
* Kinds of sentences and their parts
* Functions of sentence elements
* Writing simple business letters
* Report-writing skills
* Improving skills in using basic reference sources
* Inductive and deductive reasoning
* Grooming
* Functions of the body
* The body's utilization of food
* Types and functions of foods
* Environmental hazards
* Community sanitation and health
* Health care services
* Sexually transmitted diseases
* Accident prevention, safety, and first aid
* Mental hygiene
* Substance abuse
* Maintaining skills in fundamental operations
* Factoring and products
* Sets and simple sentences
* Numeration systems
* Using fractions and decimals
* Ratio, proportion, and percent
* Equalities and inequalities
* Simple formulas and equations
* Graphing an equation
* Powers and roots of rational numbers
* Polynomials
* Metric and nonmetric geometry
* Pythagorean Theorem
* Scale drawing
* Right-triangle trigonometry
* Customary and metric measurement
* Permutations
* Probability statistics
* Statistical terms
* Mathematics of insurance, banking, and taxes
* Basic human communities
* Community, state, and national government
* Political parties and elections
* Comparative cultures and religions
* African American, Hispanic, and other ethnic studies
* Urban studies
* Women in our history
* Conservation, including human conservation
* Resource management
* Elementary economics
* Labor and management
* Taxation
* Foundations of American democracy
* U. S. Constitution
* Rights and responsibilities of good citizenship
* United Nations
* World geography
* Advanced map and globe skills
* Earth's history
* Earth science
* Ecology and environment
* Weather and climate
* Air and air pressure
* Air masses and fronts
* Water and its uses
* Erosion
* Air and water pollution
* Heats and fuels
* Electricity and electronics
* Solar and nuclear energy
* Nature and uses of light
* Simple and complex machines
* Atomic structure
* Chemistry of matter
* Molecular theory
* Nature and use of chemicals
* Metals and plastics
* Space and astronomy
* Space travel
* Nature and causes of disease
* Evaluating material for accuracy
* Reading the newspaper
* Analyzing propaganda
* Advertising
* Drama and film
* Analyzing poetry
* Dramatic poetry
* Using poetry anthologies
* Novel and short story
* Folklore and myths
* Structure of a play
* Parable and allegory
* Interpretation of literature
* Listening skills
* Effective discussion techniques and questioning skills
* Preparing a speech
* Public speaking and debate
* The unabridged dictionary
* Vocabulary
* Foreign words used in English
* Grammar
* Fundamentals of composition
* Report writing
* Extended reference skills
* Special indexes
* Ratio and proportion
* Basic concepts of statistics
* Mathematical vocabulary
* Direct and indirect measurement
* Banks and banking
* Investment
* Budgeting
* Insurance
* Taxation
* Graphs and tables
* Informal geometry
* Elementary algebra
* Customary and metric measurement
* Absolute value
* Sets and their relationships
* Properties of polynomial forms
* Equations
* Signed numbers
* Fundamental operations
* Equations of the first degree
* Ratio, proportion, variation
* Relations and functions
* Special products and factoring
* Fractions and fractional equations
* Square roots
* Radicals
* Quadratic equations
* Elements of probability
* Prehistoric peoples
* The earliest civilizations
* The early Greeks
* Early India and China
* The Islamic world
* The Middle Ages
* African civilizations
* Civilization in the Americas
* The Renaissance
* The rise and fall of monarchies
* Birth of modern democracy
* The French Revolution
* The Industrial Revolution
* Nationalism
* Imperialism
* Science and industry
* The world wars
- World War I
- Between world wars
- World War II
* The Cold War
* The Vietnam War
* The search for peace
* Democratic ideals and values
* The rise and fall of Communism
* The collapse of the Soviet Union
* World interdependence
* World problems and issues
* Role of women in today's societies
* Characteristics of life
* Classification
* History of plants and animals
* Microscopic life
* Simple organisms: algae, bacteria, fungi
* Vertebrate life
* Mammals and birds
* Plant life
* Photosynthesis
* Cells
* Protein synthesis
* Genetics and heredity
* DNA-RNA
* Genetic engineering
* Reproduction and growth
* Human biology
* Nutrition and digestion
* Behavior
* Conservation of human resources
* Environmental issues
* Energy in ecosystems
* Scientific method
* Biology and space travel
* Disease and disease control
* American literary heritage
* Cross-cultural literature
* Folklore and ballads
* Regional customs, traditions, folkways, and language
* Literary interpretation and critique
* Novel, short story, and essay
* Understanding poetry: lyric poetry, and the sonnet
* Drama
* Distinguishing between fact and opinion
* Persuasion and argumentation
* Listening skills
* Public speaking and debate
* Extending dictionary skills
* History of the alphabet
* Vocabulary and etymology
* Geographical dialects
* Grammar
* History of writing
* Techniques of writing
* Journal writing
* Writing short stories, poetry, and plays
* Writing term papers
* Constructing footnotes
* Origins and uses of geometry
* Terms, postulates, theorems
* Sets
* Nature of proof
* Inductive and deductive reasoning
* Ratio and proportion
* Algebra in geometry
* Angle relationships
* Parallel and perpendicular lines
* Congruent triangles
* Right triangles
* Pythagorean Theorem
* Circles
* Polygons
* Relationships between circles and polygons
* Mensuration theory
* Measurement of geometric figures
* Simple constructions
* Loci
* Transformational geometry
* Introduction of symbolic logic
* Coordinate geometry
* Trigonometric functions of angles greater than 90 degrees
* Special angle relationships
* Problem solving with geometry
* Age of exploration and discovery
* Colonization of America
* A new nation is born
* Constitution of the United States
* Development of a new nation
* Period of nationalism
* Sectionalism
* American Civil War and Reconstruction
* United States as a world power
* Struggle for women's rights
* World War I
* The Great Depression
* World War II
* The Cold War
* The nuclear era
* Civil rights
* Delinquency and crime
* Psychology
* Problems of mental health
* Urbanization
* Public education
* Role of women in today's society
* Matter and its behavior
* Carbon and its compounds
* Formulas and chemical equations
* Acids, bases, salts
* Atomic theory
* Periodic law
* Water and solutions
* Chemical bonding
* Molecular theory
* Equilibrium and kinetics
* Spontaneous reactions
* Titrations
* Ionization and ionic solutions
* Colloids, suspensoids, and emulsoids
* Oxidation-reduction
* Nonmetals
* Metals and alloys
* Electrochemistry
* Energy: forms, chemical changes, and measurement
* Nuclear reactions and radioactivity
* American literature
* Cross-cultural literature
* Analysis of plays
* Vocabulary of poetry
* Critical and evaluative reading
* Propaganda techniques
* Mass communication
* Advertising
* Music and painting
* Architecture and sculpture
* Listening skills
* Vocabulary development
* Grammar
* Story writing
* Editorial writing
* Journalistic writing
* Writing term papers
* Proofreading symbols
* Use of Reader's Guide and other reference aids, both print and electronic
* Relations and functions
* Square roots, surds, radicals
* Rational roots
* Linear equations and analytic geometry
* Quadratic equations
* Binomial theorem
* Imaginary numbers
* Exponents and radicals
* Logarithms
* Progressions
* Higher-degree equations
* Vectors
* Determinants
* Permutations, combinations, and simple probability
* Estimation and approximation
* Solutions of right triangles
* Use of table and interpolation
* Measurement of angles
* Properties of trigonometric functions
* Complex numbers and vectors
* Concept of a limit
* Graphs of functions
* Solutions of oblique triangles
* Logarithms
* Identities and equations
* General triangle solutions
* Principles of U. S. government
* The democratic ideal
* Basic documents of the U. S.
* Agriculture in the U. S.
* Urbanization
* Conservation
* Business and industry in the U. S.
* American party system
* Propaganda and public opinion
* Comparative governments
* Comparative economic systems
* Consumer education
* Crime and delinquency
* Psychology
* Labor-management relations
* Economic concepts and theories
* Taxation and finance
* Distribution and exchange of goods and services
* International relations
* American foreign policy
* International organizations
* Public education
* Women's role in today's society
* Family economics and management
* Physics
* Electricity and magnetism
* Photoelectric effect
* Heat
* Light and optics
* Sound and acoustics
* Wave motion
* Quantum theory
* Relativity
* Force
* Mechanics
* Space, time, and motion
* Work, energy, and power
* Electronics
* Nuclear energy
* Nuclear physics
* Solid-state physics
* English literature
* Shakespeare
* Literary, social, and political heritage of England
* Literature of the 1900's
* World literature
* Cross-cultural literature
* The theater
* Nature of tragedy and comedy
* Techniques of acting
* Film as an art form
* Critical and evaluative reading
* Current periodical literature
* Mass communication
* Comparative study of mass media
* Radio and television
* Listening skills
* Parliamentary procedures
* Identifying verbals
* Report writing
* Writing social and business letters
* Writing book reviews, précis, essays
* Writing term papers
* Bibliography development
* Derivative of a function
* Logarithmic and trigonometric functions
* Indeterminate terms
* Computation of derivatives
* Rate of a change of quantity
* Maxima and minima
* Integrals
* Length of curves
* Volume and surface areas
* Computer analysis of graphs
* Sets of numbers
* Binomial theorem
* Progressions
* Complex numbers
* Theory of equations
* Permutations
* Functions and their graphs
* Combinations
* Probability
* Determinants
* Inequalities
* Matrix algebra
* Mathematical inductions
* The derivative
* Tabular data
* Graphs
* Measures of central tendency
* Quartiles and percentiles
* Measures of dispersion
* Simple correlation
* Statistical inference
* Permutations
* Combinations
* Binomial theorem
05-02-2009 11:45 AM
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Trar Away
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Post: #48
Re: Enough is Enough

Killjoy Wrote:Alright, technically they're morally ambiguous but they're fighting for a good cause. The sad reality is that school needs to be compulsory because most people can not or would not teach themselves given the option.
That's what you think. After a while, most people would have a hunger for knowledge, so they go and truly LEARN about things at their own pace.
05-02-2009 11:50 AM
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mrtuesday Offline
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Post: #49
Re: Enough is Enough

Trar Wrote:That's what you think. After a while, most people would have a hunger for knowledge, so they go and truly LEARN about things at their own pace.

We can't bank on "eventually." The fact is that, Electoral College notwithstanding, the MAJORITY holds political power. If most people can't be trusted to sufficiently educate themselves without our help, this nation and to a lesser extent the world are finished.
05-02-2009 11:56 AM
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returnal Away
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Post: #50
Re: Enough is Enough

Killjoy Wrote:If one's school happens to be unusually draconian, they can still opt for homeschooling or just change schools.
So, if the school does something that violates the constitution (which happens a lot), there's no point in fighting it? Just accept the violation?

woah dude
dude woah
05-02-2009 11:57 AM
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Trar Away
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Post: #51
Re: Enough is Enough

And yet all of those topics could be learned out of school, by yourself, at your own pace. And you don't even have to learn about them all! You can pick and choose the ones you like best, and work with those! With school, they cram all of that down your throat in a limited amount of time, enough to fill in dots on a piece of paper for absolutely no reason at all. Without it, you're actually LEARNING.

Oh, and besides, most of that stuff isn't necessary to live a successful, fulfilling life anyway.
05-02-2009 11:57 AM
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Leon Kinotolian Offline
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Post: #52
Re: Enough is Enough

Killjoy Wrote:
Rebelnerd Wrote:They are not the good guys. They're not bad guys either, they just don't care because they don't have to care. There is no evil brainwashing conspiracy, it's just a natural political law: you help those who can vote for you. Students count for nothing, so there's no reason to listen to them. What we have now is a large section of the population with watered-down Constitutional rights, no say in the political process, who are "taught" without consent by the government. If that doesn't seem the least bit dangerous to you, then you scare me very much.

Alright, technically they're morally ambiguous but they're fighting for a good cause. The sad reality is that school needs to be compulsory because most people can not or would not teach themselves given the option.
If I may be so bold, I must challenge your second statement.

Prior to the institution of the law (I believe it was a law, though I'm still rusty on that subject) that made school compulsory, we had centuries - nay, millenia - of intellectuals, many of which rose from humble beginnings to be some of the greatest minds in their respective eras. Likewise, many other talented men (and some women, of course) of multiple professions came from simple lives. It has been this way since civilization began.

In the modern era (from 1890-something onward, if you go from the institution of compulsory school), we have had our fair share of wisemen and the like, many of which educated themselves as their glorious predecessors had. However, the number of individuals like these is astonishingly lower than ages past. This is due in part to compulsory schooling, which focuses on memorization and instilling conformist beliefs. Granted, memorization can indeed be a vital component in learning, but only if you are memorizing bits and pieces that are necessary for what you want to learn; elsewise, it's tedious, dull, and rather pointless.

But I digress.

I'd like to return your attention to the point in my first paragraph. Much prior to compulsory schooling, the masses were always self-motivated to learn some sort of trade, acquire intellect, accumulate experience, so on and so forth. If we removed compulsory schooling now, or at the very least dropped the 'compulsory' aspect (forgive me if I'm being repetitious), we can expect the populace to once again resume their self-education, picking up where their ancestors left off, and rechaining our past to our present and future more efficiently. Admittedly, there is a slight chance that said resurrection of massed self-education may not happen for a few years, but it isn't as if the world will crumple up on itself if a few people haven't yet regained the natural drive to learn.

On a side note, I may go back and comment/question/debate your points on previous pages, if only because this topic expanded quite fast in my absence. I hope you won't mind.

*Tentaclerape*
Hidden stuff:
The Desert Fox Wrote:
Rebelnerd Wrote:Avatar was an inside job.
For $9.11 I'll give you an inside job.
Raikuron Wrote:Okay. I fail. DISREGARD THAT EVERYONE, I SUCK COCKS!
BaronVonStrangle Wrote:fox you should take everything mystery says with a pinch of salt

and by pinch of salt i actually mean you need to build a fucking salt processing plant so you have enough salt to dispell the bullshit
05-02-2009 11:58 AM
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Trar Away
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Post: #53
Re: Enough is Enough

Killjoy Wrote:
Trar Wrote:That's what you think. After a while, most people would have a hunger for knowledge, so they go and truly LEARN about things at their own pace.

We can't bank on "eventually." The fact is that, Electoral College notwithstanding, the MAJORITY holds political power. If most people can't be trusted to sufficiently educate themselves without our help, this nation and to a lesser extent the world are finished.
The people that have an ambition for learning have more of a chance to influence the lazy bums now that school is over. The lazy bums would be drawn to the advantages, but of course nothing is perfect. Some people will still refuse to learn. They are either still affected by the school system in a way, or screwed up in another way.
05-02-2009 12:01 PM
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mrtuesday Offline
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Post: #54
Re: Enough is Enough

Leon Kinotolian Wrote:Prior to the institution of the law (I believe it was a law, though I'm still rusty on that subject) that made school compulsory, we had centuries - nay, millenia - of intellectuals, many of which rose from humble beginnings to be some of the greatest minds in their respective eras. Likewise, many other talented men (and some women, of course) of multiple professions came from simple lives. It has been this way since civilization began.

Only the great men are remembered. It's history's natural bias. Ever since the Agricultural Revolution, people have had the time to truly pursue education. We've since come to a consensus about which topics are of more importance than others and we teach children about them at a progressive rate throughout their youth by virtue of the school system.

Leon Kinotolian Wrote:In the modern era (from 1890-something onward, if you go from the institution of compulsory school), we have had our fair share of wisemen and the like, many of which educated themselves as their glorious predecessors had. However, the number of individuals like these is astonishingly lower than ages past. This is due in part to compulsory schooling, which focuses on memorization and instilling conformist beliefs. Granted, memorization can indeed be a vital component in learning, but only if you are memorizing bits and pieces that are necessary for what you want to learn; elsewise, it's tedious, dull, and rather pointless.

Comparatively speaking, 1890 and onward is a miniscule amount of time. It's only natural that we haven't matched the brilliant minds of the Renaissance yet. America is a young nation. You can't blame compulsory schooling for this apparent lack of achievement. If anything, it bolsters learning. School may be tedious and dull to you, but to others it's just a necessary facet of their childhood so that they can mature into intelligent, well-informed adults capable of making their own decisions on not only political matters but life matters as well. Again I must mention that schools do not promote conformism. They promote citizenship, and the main precept of citizenship is for people to always question things.

Leon Kinotolian Wrote:I'd like to return your attention to the point in my first paragraph. Much prior to compulsory schooling, the masses were always self-motivated to learn some sort of trade, acquire intellect, accumulate experience, so on and so forth. If we removed compulsory schooling now, or at the very least dropped the 'compulsory' aspect (forgive me if I'm being repetitious), we can expect the populace to once again resume their self-education, picking up where their ancestors left off, and rechaining our past to our present and future more efficiently. Admittedly, there is a slight chance that said resurrection of massed self-education may not happen for a few years, but it isn't as if the world will crumple up on itself if a few people haven't yet regained the natural drive to learn.

Compulsory didn't make all intellectual achievement vanish. Any apparent correlation between compulsory schooling's induction and mental strides is superficial at best, we cannot really determine whether there is a causal link or not. Those who are inclined to learn will do so regardless of compulsory schooling or not. Those who aren't can only benefit from it.
05-02-2009 12:10 PM
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Post: #55
Re: Enough is Enough

Killjoy Wrote:Comparatively speaking, 1890 and onward is a miniscule amount of time. It's only natural that we haven't matched the brilliant minds of the Renaissance yet. America is a young nation. You can't blame compulsory schooling for this apparent lack of achievement. If anything, it bolsters learning. School may be tedious and dull to you, but to others it's just a necessary facet of their childhood so that they can mature into intelligent, well-informed adults capable of making their own decisions on not only political matters but life matters as well. Again I must mention that schools do not promote conformism. They promote citizenship, and the main precept of citizenship is for people to always question things.
I'm sorry. All I saw as I read that part was "I'M A BRAINWASHED FOOL." Again, I apologize for adding ad hominem to this debate, but i just had to get it out.
05-02-2009 12:13 PM
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returnal Away
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Post: #56
Re: Enough is Enough

Killjoy: So I'm 13, which automatically means I'm not as informed as some random adult picked from off the street?

woah dude
dude woah
05-02-2009 12:15 PM
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mrtuesday Offline
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Post: #57
Re: Enough is Enough

Trar Wrote:I'm sorry. All I saw as I read that part was "I'M A BRAINWASHED FOOL." Again, I apologize for adding ad hominem to this debate, but i just had to get it out.

Don't you have homework to do or something? /sarcasm

Newtown Wrote:Killjoy: So I'm 13, which automatically means I'm not as informed as some random adult picked from off the street?

Let's not bring ageist nonsense into the equation. It's just that most adults have been through more than you and have an idea of what skills are required to succeed in life, both financially and otherwise. You should take their advice to heart and utilize their guidance rather than shunning their experience and continuing to exist in a pipe dream where you know everything you'll ever need to know. It's like buying a model kit and throwing out the instructions. You might need them later on.
05-02-2009 12:21 PM
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Trar Away
R.I.P.

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Post: #58
Re: Enough is Enough

Killjoy Wrote:Don't you have homework to do or something? /sarcasm

I have a mound of homework and make-up work I won't be doing. I know your post was sarcasm, but i'm serious here.
05-02-2009 12:23 PM
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Leon Kinotolian Offline
Admincat

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Post: #59
Re: Enough is Enough

Killjoy Wrote:
Newtown Wrote:Killjoy: So I'm 13, which automatically means I'm not as informed as some random adult picked from off the street?

Let's not bring ageist nonsense into the equation. It's just that most adults have been through more than you and have an idea of what skills are required to succeed in life, both financially and otherwise. You should take their advice to heart and utilize their guidance rather than shunning their experience and continuing to exist in a pipe dream where you know everything you'll ever need to know.
In regards to the bolded statement: Thank Fucking You. The last thing I want to hear out of a debater is ageist remarks, and the fact you have shunned such things brings you greater respect in my eyes, as should it amongst other members.

I notice that you say most adults have been through more than us. Perhaps this is true, and perhaps there is fallacy laced within this logic. You must first consider what "most" is to you. There are a great deal of individuals under 21 that have seen more things than some adults. I, myself, can share an elaborate number of experiences, moments, and life-changing events that would make some adults seriously contemplate the possibility that they're not as enlightened as some might thing.

Note: I am not so biased against my elders as to think every last one of them believes they are god-like in intellect and the like. However, I have heard of and met with quite a few who hold this belief. Therefore, it's not unreasonable for me to throw that into my argument.

*Tentaclerape*
Hidden stuff:
The Desert Fox Wrote:
Rebelnerd Wrote:Avatar was an inside job.
For $9.11 I'll give you an inside job.
Raikuron Wrote:Okay. I fail. DISREGARD THAT EVERYONE, I SUCK COCKS!
BaronVonStrangle Wrote:fox you should take everything mystery says with a pinch of salt

and by pinch of salt i actually mean you need to build a fucking salt processing plant so you have enough salt to dispell the bullshit
05-02-2009 12:29 PM
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Trar Away
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Post: #60
Re: Enough is Enough

I knew he was nothing but an ageist, brainwashed fool. He has good debating technique, though.
05-02-2009 12:35 PM
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