why shoulds kids be forced 2 stand 4 the pledge?

[avragerebellion101]

feb 22, 2010, the teachr finally caught me nawt standng 4pledge - wats wrong with tht? "do u not respect america?" i do...but do i have 2 show it?

[Absnt]

I'm against standing for the pledge. It seems in the U.S, people are still all about national pride and what not. I think this will quickly change when the government starts charging higher tax rates to pay back the national debt and what not.

In any case, I disagree with getting kids to stand up and say the pledge, it's coltish/regimeish. It gives me a weird feeling of being in some kind of brainwashing institution.

Oh wait.

[Rebelnerd]

Well, it's illegal to force kids to stand. This has been brought to court many times before. They'll probably harass you over it, but they can't actually punish you.

[CrayolaColours]

I find something deeply unsettling about the fact that every day we have to say a pledge to America. Something seems off about it. When gym is over (We can't even hear the pledge in the gym room, and I have it first hour) I've decided that I'm no longer standing for the pledge. "Liberty and justice for all."

I refuse to say something that isn't true, for gays, and children.

I made my official decision when my friend said that they let gay men into the military, but not gay women. Whether that's true or not, I don't know, but I refuse to stand anyway.

[Absnt]

Rebelnerd Wrote:Well, it's illegal to force kids to stand. This has been brought to court many times before. They'll probably harass you over it, but they can't actually punish you.

In my school you have to stand for the pledge unless your parents sign a form that says you don't have to and why. So it's not illegal to force kids to unless the parents agree.

Total bullshit.

[Wingless]

I tend to salute the flag often...with my middle finger.

We obviously don't have justice for all in this country, and until there is, I see no reason to stand for the pledge.

[avragerebellion101]

i lovee u guys 4 backng me up...teachrs, 1 friend n parents sure aint

[avragerebellion101]

mind if i say tht 2 my teachr illusive man? XD

[Wingless]

Sure, go ahead

[CrayolaColours]

avragerebellion101 Wrote:mind if i say tht 2 my teachr illusive man? XD

NO. It's OUR idea.






Naw... I'm kiddin.

[Loxor]

I just like all the hail the motherland tunes, disregarding the meaning of course.

My Country 'tis of thee, sweet land of liberty...

[returnal]

Absentinsomniac Wrote:

Rebelnerd Wrote:Well, it's illegal to force kids to stand. This has been brought to court many times before. They'll probably harass you over it, but they can't actually punish you.

In my school you have to stand for the pledge unless your parents sign a form that says you don't have to and why. So it's not illegal to force kids to unless the parents agree.

Total bullshit.

It's completely illegal.

Your parents can goad you all they want but the school can't make them sign a form.

[Kirby]

Students in Canada have to sing the national anthem. In French.

[Ceiling Cat]

The only pledge we have here is usually in the first year of any school, and on graduation. I always mock the words, or say everything opposite.

[CrayolaColours]

My friend, who's a britfag at heart, made a British version and says that every day.

[Happy Camper]

Define force.

Next time, just don't stand.

[Fire Elf]

We don't have that here. It sounds really fucked up, like the schools have given up on trying to look like anything other then a place of brainwashing.

[CrayolaColours]

Fire Elf Wrote:We don't have that here. It sounds really fucked up, like the schools have given up on trying to look like anything other then a place of brainwashing.

Where do you live?

America's been doing it for, what? 100 years or so? Longer?

[LOON_ATTIC]

To make you serve the nation/government at all costs.

[Happy Camper]

Fire Elf Wrote:We don't have that here. It sounds really fucked up, like the schools have given up on trying to look like anything other then a place of brainwashing.

Let me put this simply.

I'm inclined to assume you're painting a worse image than what is actually in place. I think people use the word force very lightly on here. I'm not saying there won't be consequences but in the big scope of things, the consequences are probably trivial and could be used as a platform for conversation to take place rather than severe enough to constitute force.

If you're so against it, don't stand up and say the pledge. Let us know what happens. I bet the worst that happens is some parent teacher conference.

[CrayolaColours]

Here's our pledge:

Quote:I pledge allegiance, to the flag, of the United States of America, and to the republic, which it stands, one nation, under god, indivisible, with liberty, and justice for all.

The commas are where we pause. There's a sort of rhythm to it that's engraved into my skull.

Now, here is the original one, when it was first written :

Quote:I pledge allegiance to my Flag and the Republic for which it stands, one nation indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.

Notice the difference? What struck me was 1. The lack of "under god" and 2. the "to my flag". Instead of "The flag of the United States of America"

[LOON_ATTIC]

CrayolaColours Wrote:

Quote:I pledge allegiance to my Flag and the Republic for which it stands, one nation indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.

That one is win. I see it as a sort of saying that you stand by yourself and declare yourself free and will fight for your own freedom.

[Ceiling Cat]

And not for the hive, most important - as well as not for the religion nobody wants or signed up for.

[The Desert Fox]

I stopped doing it three years ago.

[Lovey]

I still do, ahaha...I stand up, hand-on-my-heart, and face the general direction, but I usually sing with whatever's on my player.
There's one guy in class who doesn't...I couldn't stand the looks my other classmates gave him. (Not so much 'looks' as "wtf? dude not cool")

[Absnt]

Let's all just say this one instead:

CrayolaColours Wrote:I pledge allegiance to my Flag and the Republic for which it stands, one nation indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.

[CrayolaColours]

Pretty much. The original pledge wasn't supposed to be said every day as a routine, if I remember. It was more of like the anthem that's sung before major sporting events.

I think the change of "to my flag" to "to the flag of the United States of America" and the addition of "Under god" were the two biggest fails of American history.

You can't force someone to acknowledge the existence of someone else's god. In forcing people to stand every day to praise America, we've forgotten why we fought for freedom in the revolution.

[fish20]

I stand but I never put the hand on my heart or salute.

[Jackass McAwesome]

I once stood and gave the American flag the middle finger.

[Night]

I stand, because it feels awkward not to, also because i don't want to hear pitney go, "c'mon Anna, stand up!" in his moronic mocking tone.
But i just stand that's all and stare at my teacher...he gives me the death glare, I give him the death glare right back. One day I won't stand, I think.