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Zeitgeist: Moving Forward
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Miller0700 Offline
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Post: #1
Zeitgeist: Moving Forward

What do you think of it?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Z9WVZddH9w



Its over 2 hrs and 40 mins long. And I watched the whole thing.

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07-23-2011 09:57 AM
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HeartofShadows Offline
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Post: #2
Re: Zeitgeist: Moving Forward

Dude too long didn't watch.
Please can you sum up the most important parts.. Please!!

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07-23-2011 10:02 AM
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Miller0700 Offline
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Post: #3
Re: Zeitgeist: Moving Forward

HeartofShadows Wrote:Dude too long didn't watch.
Please can you sum up the most important parts.. Please!!


Alright here: A feature length documentary work which presents a case for a needed transition out of the current socioeconomic monetary paradigm which governs the entire world society. This subject matter will transcend the issues of cultural relativism and traditional ideology and move to relate the core, empirical "life ground" attributes of human and social survival, extrapolating those immutable natural laws into a new sustainable social paradigm called a "Resource-Based Economy".

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1781069/plotsummary

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07-23-2011 10:07 AM
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thewake Offline
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Post: #4
Re: Zeitgeist: Moving Forward

I've watched the first two movies, and all I can say is that they are B.S.

They don't understand economics. The entirety of a "resource based" economy sounds eerily like communism, just with robots.

And how will it deal with scarcity? We don't live in a post-scarcity society. At any one time, there is a limited amount of labor, capital, and goods.

The price system deals with scarcity, supply and demand, by putting a price on things. I would hate to think that people don't understand this basic tenet of economics.

What you need to understand is that scarcity is not created by the profit-based capitalist economy. Capitalism is how people deal with scarcity when given freedom to buy, sell, and own property.

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07-24-2011 04:10 AM
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Alucard483 Offline
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Post: #5
Re: Zeitgeist: Moving Forward

Zeitgeist: Uneducated people acting educated

Whilst some work diligently there are those who ask why. I am one of them
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07-24-2011 05:32 AM
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John Tuttle Offline
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Post: #6
Re: Zeitgeist: Moving Forward

Alucard483 Wrote:Zeitgeist: Uneducated people acting educated

This.

The first Zeitgeist is so hilariously wrong it is hilarious. Like literally all their theories of religion are so stupid to anyone with basic knowledge of theology and astronomy.

The second Zeitgeist was pretty stupid but not as bad as the first one - until they went all technocracy on our asses. Sorry, I don't want to live in a society run by a caste of technocrats.

I haven't seen this one yet, but I imagine it is just as bad.

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07-24-2011 03:18 PM
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alexander144 Offline
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RE: Zeitgeist: Moving Forward

(07-24-2011 04:10 AM)Weswammy Wrote:  I've watched the first two movies, and all I can say is that they are B.S.

They don't understand economics. The entirety of a "resource based" economy sounds eerily like communism, just with robots.

And how will it deal with scarcity? We don't live in a post-scarcity society. At any one time, there is a limited amount of labor, capital, and goods.

The price system deals with scarcity, supply and demand, by putting a price on things. I would hate to think that people don't understand this basic tenet of economics.

What you need to understand is that scarcity is not created by the profit-based capitalist economy. Capitalism is how people deal with scarcity when given freedom to buy, sell, and own property.

Did you watch moving forward? What you have questioned here is explained in it. Basically though, people will not be greedy so that wouldn't be an issue and robots would do most of the hard labor. I could go into more detail but where is the point when you could watch the movie and understand it far better then what I could explain.

EDIT: If you're really not bothered watching the movie you can have a look at this site for some answers: http://www.thevenusproject.com/en/the-venus-project/faq
(This post was last modified: 10-03-2011 08:39 PM by alexander144.)
10-03-2011 08:12 PM
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Liquid Offline
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Post: #8
RE: Zeitgeist: Moving Forward

Haven't watched this one yet, will do when I've got time Smile

Their position is similar to the Technocracy movement in the 1930s and Toffler's stuff about the 3rd Wave.

The Venus project is wrong on a lot of it's points even though they're looking in the right direction. I think Toffler's ideas are closer to the truth. We're living at one of history's transition periods:

Wave 1: Hunting-Gathering & Nomadism ---> Farming & Prosumerism
Wave 2: Farming & Prosumerism ---> Specialization & Consumerism
Wave 3 Specialization & Consumerism ---> Something New

Also:
Demand > Possible Production --------- pre - 2nd Industrial Revolution
Demand = Possible Production --------- 1900s
Demand < Possible Production --------- future?

//

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(This post was last modified: 10-04-2011 08:13 AM by Liquid.)
10-04-2011 07:55 AM
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Blobthe15 Offline
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Post: #9
RE: Zeitgeist: Moving Forward

TL;DW
Instead I watched this:



Hidden stuff:
Rebelnerd:
Again, I agree with you. School does teach you things. And once again, you are missing the point entirely. It's not that I disagree with school's mission or the things it teaches. What I object to is that the students are deprived of any choice in the matter. As benign as the intentions may be, any system that forces people into an environment where they have no say in their lives is a situation ripe for abuse of power.

I am Blobthe15, creator of threads that die too quickly.

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The Desert Fox Wrote:Down with Soulriser! It is time for the God of Gods to become the Fallen God of Fallen Gods!
You'll end up like Prometheus, chained to a rock with a bird eating your internal organs.

Or as close as that can be recreated on an internet forum.
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(02-08-2012 01:06 PM)Lunatic Wrote:  everyone says emo is like a music style or hair stile or clothing or cutting yourself but i think its like a sexuality just like being gay but a different kind of gay just like transexuals you know
10-04-2011 08:24 AM
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alexander144 Offline
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Post: #10
RE: Zeitgeist: Moving Forward

(10-04-2011 08:24 AM)Blobthe15 Wrote:  TL;DW
Instead I watched this:



Hahahaha that was great, they took the piss out of the zeitgeist movie a bit and Joseph but in a good way and the overall message at the end was really good.
10-04-2011 11:51 AM
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Thought Criminal Offline
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Post: #11
RE: Zeitgeist: Moving Forward

It's a nice idea but it could never work in practice. I was really into it after I first found it but once I dove deeper into the mechanics of it I realized it was quite flawed, like wes said it has no means of dealing with scarcity, and the technology needed to sustain such a society without any sort of real human labor is centuries from attainable.
10-04-2011 12:46 PM
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alexander144 Offline
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RE: Zeitgeist: Moving Forward

(10-04-2011 12:46 PM)Thought Criminal Wrote:  It's a nice idea but it could never work in practice. I was really into it after I first found it but once I dove deeper into the mechanics of it I realized it was quite flawed, like wes said it has no means of dealing with scarcity, and the technology needed to sustain such a society without any sort of real human labor is centuries from attainable.

Well it isn't going to happen overnight obviously. I think project venus is a good destination to want to get to and we should work towards it. When I say it isn't going to happen overnight I mean I doubt It will even happen in out lifetime but think about it. Is it better we stay on the sinking ship that is capitalism or work towards a better future for all of mankind?
(This post was last modified: 10-04-2011 12:55 PM by alexander144.)
10-04-2011 12:55 PM
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Thought Criminal Offline
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RE: Zeitgeist: Moving Forward

I'm not saying working towards a more sustainable society is a bad thing, Project Venus is a good jumping off point but there is much about it that would need to be changed and worked with as time goes on. Capitalism cannot sustain our society and planet forever. I think changing the mindset of our global society, eliminating the mindless mass consumerism which is ravaging out planet to the detriment of all life on it, in favor of a lifestyle which sustains ourselves and the Earth is a step in the right direction. I don't believe religion or greed(Capitalism) can get us there.
(This post was last modified: 10-04-2011 01:11 PM by Thought Criminal.)
10-04-2011 01:10 PM
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alexander144 Offline
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RE: Zeitgeist: Moving Forward

(10-04-2011 01:10 PM)Thought Criminal Wrote:  I'm not saying working towards a more sustainable society is a bad thing, Project Venus is a good jumping off point but there is much about it that would need to be changed and worked with as time goes on. Capitalism cannot sustain our society and planet forever. I think changing the mindset of our global society, eliminating the mindless mass consumerism which is ravaging out planet to the detriment of all life on it, in favor of a lifestyle which sustains ourselves and the Earth is a step in the right direction. I don't believe religion or greed(Capitalism) can get us there.

Yeah exactly. I like to see project Venus as something to head towards while on the journey to fix the flaws in society. The thing that pisses me off though is when people say that zeitgeist is bullshit and how it will never work and instead keep living in denial that capitalism is fine. Zeitgeist may not be 100% right on everything but its a fuckton better then the road so many people are on today.
10-04-2011 01:24 PM
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Miller0700 Offline
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RE: Zeitgeist: Moving Forward

(10-04-2011 01:10 PM)Thought Criminal Wrote:  I think changing the mindset of our global society, eliminating the mindless mass consumerism which is ravaging out planet to the detriment of all life on it, in favor of a lifestyle which sustains ourselves and the Earth is a step in the right direction. I don't believe religion or greed(Capitalism) can get us there.

This.

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10-05-2011 06:29 AM
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Liquid Offline
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RE: Zeitgeist: Moving Forward

Let's not piss on Capitalism too much, it worked great in the past and was the best possible system for the time period. It's starting to show it's age now though.

Our civilization is naturally progressing to a new level now, and our current economic systems will eventually hit a point where they will stop functioning unless they are seriously upgraded. The new systems probably will be child-systems of the current ones.

//

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10-06-2011 03:23 AM
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.Manicrose. Offline
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RE: Zeitgeist: Moving Forward

(10-05-2011 06:29 AM)Derchin Wrote:  
(10-04-2011 01:10 PM)Thought Criminal Wrote:  I think changing the mindset of our global society, eliminating the mindless mass consumerism which is ravaging out planet to the detriment of all life on it, in favor of a lifestyle which sustains ourselves and the Earth is a step in the right direction. I don't believe religion or greed(Capitalism) can get us there.

This.
YES YES YES

Go to work. Send your kids to school. Follow fashion. Act normal. Walk on the pavement. Watch TV. Save for your old age. Obey the law. Repeat after me: "I am free."

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10-06-2011 04:55 AM
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Phrozen_Soul Offline
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RE: Zeitgeist: Moving Forward

(07-24-2011 05:32 AM)Alucard483 Wrote:  Zeitgeist: Uneducated people acting educated

Pretty much this.

Also I love your Hellsing avatars.

"Ask them no more questions, never hear them lying"

People say the problem with me is I have psychotic tendencies and care not about other human beings I don't like and or know. So?
10-08-2011 10:37 AM
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