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Gender questions?
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coffee Offline
not at all awkward

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Post: #1
Gender questions?

Okay, so since this is my first real thread I'm gonna go ahead and apologize in advance in case I act like a moron on accident. Also, I'm sorta in a rush because it's 10:40 am, I'm supposed to be in school and my older brother's down stairs and he could wake up at any moment and kick me out. (It's just these...thoughts are starting to bother me a lot)

Now anyways, back to my train of thought...

I was wondering what your thoughts were considering gender and sex?

Do you think gender is a social construct?

If so, what about all these transsexuals and what not?

And where did these stereotypes about certain genders/sexes come from if gender is a social construct? Are some of most of them actually true? Or are people too scared or lazy to go outside of the socially norm?
(example: females are physically weak, more emotional, caring, etc. And males are naturally, physically strong, more aggressive, competitive and so-on.)

How does one know if their a "man" or a "woman" or something else?

And what about the biology of it all?


I was wondering about all of this because I guess you could say I'm having...issues considering my gender, sex, whatever.
My thoughts before were leaning toward gender being socially constructed but then transsexuals or whatever came to mind and then that sort of blew a hole in it.

I guess I'm putting too much stress on gender not being "real". It's "real" enough in the minds of people, like male = whatever they think it means (but it's all pretty much the same in everyone's eyes anyways).

But, yeah, sorry again if that made no sense to you, I've just been stressing out about that for the last couple...years.
So, looking forward to your thoughts...

Uggh, I need a cup of coffee before visiting hours are over.
01-15-2013 03:07 AM
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no Offline
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Post: #2
Gender questions?

(barely related) This morning my precalc teacher said to the class "If you need to ask yourself 'am I gay if I do this?' you probably shouldn't do it." The guy makes me so bloody sick.

Hello, traveler.

This is an ancient account I have not used in a long time. My views have changed much in the intervening months and years.

Nonetheless, I refuse to clean it up. Pretending that I've held my current views since the beginning of time is what we in the industry call a lie. Asking people to do so contributes to moralistic self-loathing. "See, those people have nothing damning! I do! I'm truly vile!"

Because you can never be a good person with a single blemish on the moral record, I thought that simply entertaining some thoughts made me irredeemable. Though I don't care for his writing style, William Faulkner presents a good counterexample. He went from being a typical Southern racist to supporting the civil rights movement. These days we'd yell at him for that, probably.

People are allowed to change their views.

Nevertheless, this period of my life has informed some of how I am today. In good ways and bad ways. To purge it would be to do a disservice to history. Perhaps it will not make anyone sympathetic, but it may help someone understand.

If, after reading all this, you still decide to use the post above as evidence that I am evil today, ask yourself if you have never disagreed with the moral code you now follow. In all likelihood you did, at some point. If some questions are verboten, and the answer is "how dare you ask that," don't expect your ideological opponents to ever change their minds.
01-15-2013 06:58 AM
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SoulRiser Offline
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Post: #3
RE: Gender questions?

Well... If you limit this to just physical stuff, males and females have some different parts, and it may be more difficult for females to put on muscle and such...

As far as sensitivity and emotions go, I think that's pretty much all dependent on social stuff and personality... I know some very sensitive guys, and some really insensitive women with no empathy whatsoever... So I don't believe any of that stuff about females being kind and males being less so.

So... I personally just go by physical parts when differentiating between male and female humans... And I ignore the other stuff. With that said, for some odd reason I seem to get along better with guys than girls (in general)... But I just think that's because I don't fit the stereotype of females at all. But I believe this has nothing to do with the fact that they are female, it's just the way they turned out because they went along with the 'girls are like this and boys are like that' society stuff or whatever, which I somehow completely ignored.

In short: I dunno. I think people make gender out to be much of a bigger deal than it should be. We're all people, some of us have some different parts, many of us take that too seriously and base our behaviour on which dangly bits we have... Seems silly to me.

"If you can, help others; if you cannot do that, at least do not harm them." - Dalai Lama
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01-15-2013 10:02 AM
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IamNoone Offline
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Post: #4
Gender questions?

Gender and sex is biologically defined, but this definition is less and less relevant as the nature of our necessary tasks as human beings evolves and our psychology becomes more complex. At this point, gender is more cultural, but some things (like which sex does hard labor, which cares for a child) is biological.

Whatever the hell you are, just either pick a side or don't get offended when people mistake you for the wrong gender.

The purpose of life is a life with a purpose
So I’d rather die for a cause than live a life that is worthless
I don’t need the circus or the day of national observance
I need you to think for you and stop being a servant
-Immortal Technique, The Martyr, The Martyr
01-15-2013 11:03 AM
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SoulRiser Offline
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Post: #5
Gender questions?

People have been mistaking me for the wrong gender for as long as I can remember... and not just online. Razz

"If you can, help others; if you cannot do that, at least do not harm them." - Dalai Lama
Help & Support - Get help with leaving school, unsupportive parents, and more.
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"Believe those who are seeking the truth. Doubt those who find it." - André Paul Guillaume Gide
"The true sign of intelligence is not knowledge but imagination." - Albert Einstein
"I'm pretty sure there's a lot of beauty that can only be found in the mind of a lunatic." - TheCancer
EIPD - Emotionally Incompetent Parent Disorder

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01-16-2013 01:33 AM
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coffee Offline
not at all awkward

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Post: #6
RE: Gender questions?

People always think I'm the opposite sex than what I am, which is what I want them to think to be honest, but I don't get offended or anything if they guess right.
It's always funny when they see me in the bathroom though.
01-16-2013 02:59 AM
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SoulRiser Offline
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Post: #7
Gender questions?

I get more annoyed when people make comments about me not being "lady-like" than I do about them thinking I'm a guy. I am what I am, I don't give a damn what they think I should be like... screw them Razz

"If you can, help others; if you cannot do that, at least do not harm them." - Dalai Lama
Help & Support - Get help with leaving school, unsupportive parents, and more.
Click here if school makes you depressed or suicidal

Support School Survival on Patreon or Donate Bitcoin Here: 1Q5WCcxWjayniaL92b8GfXBiGdfjmnUNa2
"Believe those who are seeking the truth. Doubt those who find it." - André Paul Guillaume Gide
"The true sign of intelligence is not knowledge but imagination." - Albert Einstein
"I'm pretty sure there's a lot of beauty that can only be found in the mind of a lunatic." - TheCancer
EIPD - Emotionally Incompetent Parent Disorder

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01-16-2013 06:24 AM
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thewake Offline
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Post: #8
Gender questions?

Gender is a social construct built around the very real biological construct of sex. There are also very real differences that have been demonstrated in the male and female psyche, which I would attribute, at least partially, to the hormonal and genetic differences between biological males and biological female. That isn't to say there is anything wrong with being homosexual/transgendered, but these people do stray from the norm.

If I had to guess, in an armchair philosopher manner, I'd say that the cultural male/female gender differences directly evolved from the built-in male/female sex difference. In hunter-gatherer bands, females were expected to have children. That put them at reduced capacity to do things like hunt and such (not to mention the fact males are, on average, more physically robust than females). Also, if one looks at male/female differences in other primates, one finds that the roles of males and females are not identical. Males take leadership positions in primate groups that females don't. This makes one think the line between biological sex and cultural gender is a bit blurred, and there are more built in differences between males and females than is commonly believed.

In modern society, these differences have become adapted to the modern extended order of human association that we call capitalism and civilization. Sometimes, this has caused an exacerbation of gender differences, such as in the 1950s when many women were housewives. However, over time I believe the trend has been the breaking down of gender differences as men and women come to participate together in the workforce as, more or less, equals.

As far as transgendered people are concerned, there is historical precedent for females taking the role of males in Albania (click here). I don't know what causes it and, frankly, it's none of my business as long as they're being peaceful. All evidence indicates transgendered people are about as peaceful as everyone else.

But men and women, males and females, are different. I'm reminded of a John Stossel special I saw once and it was really interesting. I couldn't find the actual special bu here's an audio excerpt voiced by Stossel that sums it up:


Watch on YouTube

[Image: nAOqYk7.png]

[Image: USVWSwj.png]
(This post was last modified: 01-16-2013 02:05 PM by thewake.)
01-16-2013 02:04 PM
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LOON_ATTIC Offline
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Post: #9
RE: Gender questions?

(01-15-2013 03:07 AM)Natures Leftovers Wrote:  Okay, so since this is my first real thread I'm gonna go ahead and apologize in advance in case I act like a moron on accident. Also, I'm sorta in a rush because it's 10:40 am, I'm supposed to be in school and my older brother's down stairs and he could wake up at any moment and kick me out. (It's just these...thoughts are starting to bother me a lot)

Now anyways, back to my train of thought...

I was wondering what your thoughts were considering gender and sex?
You can be physically/biologically male or female, or maybe a sort of hermaphrodite, which is really rare.
Psychological gender identity can be an entirely different thing.


Do you think gender is a social construct?
not really. depends on what you mean by "gender". gender roles... yeah I suppose.

If so, what about all these transsexuals and what not?
meh. don't really care, except when people with penises pretend to be women and try to attract me and then i'd find out that they have penises and I don't want that. Or when they go around shouting DIE CIS SCUM. that's about all that I could care about.

And where did these stereotypes about certain genders/sexes come from if gender is a social construct? Are some of most of them actually true? Or are people too scared or lazy to go outside of the socially norm?
(example: females are physically weak, more emotional, caring, etc. And males are naturally, physically strong, more aggressive, competitive and so-on.)
probably because women generally go though pregnancy, etc so they tend to psychologically be more caring to take care of their babies or something. and I guess they're just statistically weaker, even if some of them can do all the crap that men do, it's just a fact. but the whole homophobia thing is fucking religion-inspired bullshit IMO. I'm still trying to get rid of my homophobia. It's good to not be scared of the possibility of "OMG AM I GAY I DON'T WANNA BE GAY I HATE MYSELF", and not giving a damn.
Society also shouldn't punish men for being emotional as long as they're not doing something fucking stupid (damaging) while being it, and it shouldn't deny women from pursuing things that are supposedly "manly" either, because they're often perfectly capable of doing those things as well.
Now as to why people started being discriminatory, I can't really say.


How does one know if their a "man" or a "woman" or something else?
By what's between your legs? It doesn't seem that hard.
If someone feels uncomfortable thinking of being what their biological gender is, I can't really say much because I've never experienced that or really knew someone well who did (I sort of did online, I just acted like it wasn't that big a deal), but it's not my problem or my "job" to tell people what they should or should not feel if it doesn't harm other people.


And what about the biology of it all?
in 99.9999% of cases or something like that biological gender is simply male or female and can be easily determined based either on genitals or genetic data (what chromosomes you have...) but according to wikipedia there have been "true human hermaphrodites"?...

I was wondering about all of this because I guess you could say I'm having...issues considering my gender, sex, whatever.
My thoughts before were leaning toward gender being socially constructed but then transsexuals or whatever came to mind and then that sort of blew a hole in it.

I guess I'm putting too much stress on gender not being "real". It's "real" enough in the minds of people, like male = whatever they think it means (but it's all pretty much the same in everyone's eyes anyways).

But, yeah, sorry again if that made no sense to you, I've just been stressing out about that for the last couple...years.
So, looking forward to your thoughts...

Uggh, I need a cup of coffee before visiting hours are over.

imo it doesn't make sense to get depressed over something that won't harm other people (I often am, so it's a bit hypocritical to say this but I try not to be), so don't be ashamed of whatever... just if you're worried about the possibility of being a transexual or whatever, I don't exactly thing is something to worry about or be ashamed of.

also, what. I've always thought of gender being entirely synonymous with sex, and not gender being a sort of a "wrapper" or "social construct" around it.
(This post was last modified: 01-17-2013 03:58 PM by LOON_ATTIC.)
01-17-2013 03:52 PM
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thewake Offline
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Post: #10
Gender questions?

>2031
>non-gender specific parental coven takes my head mate and I to the zoo
>exhibits are open and non-human species are free to mingle with park guests because the zoo is no longer human-centrist
>Approached by white cismale
>hand him a Privelege Peanut and he runs away
>go home and read Communist Manifesto
>have nightmare that Karl Marx is checking my privilege while a white cismale votes for DOMA bills.
>Call for non-gender labelled member of parental coven to soothe me back to sleep
>Xi refuses and I am left in the dark because xie's frightened and my demand for comfort does not counterweigh xier demand for safety

[Image: nAOqYk7.png]

[Image: USVWSwj.png]
01-18-2013 01:37 AM
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