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Maybe We Should Start Something
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SomeRandomHuman Offline
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Post: #31
RE: Maybe We Should Start Something

^10K a year per student? My mom didnt even make that much money in a year. No wonder this city is going bankrupt...
11-23-2012 11:18 PM
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Post: #32
RE: Maybe We Should Start Something

(11-23-2012 08:54 PM)Potato Wrote:  "Don't look at teachers, or even school administrators, or the government, as the enemy."

dividing students into classes and assigning each class a teacher is much less efficient that making the information available as a single source on the internet (as khan academy does), but it does provide more jobs (millions more), which is of course what they'd care about the most. and sources on the internet such as khan academy has the potential to lower the cost of grade education from $10k per student per year (so about $120,000 k-12 per student), to the cost of a computer and an internet connection per student. so yes it really is our AND the tax payers' interest against the teacher's union's.

What if we had way fewer teachers but they all got paid double what they are paid now and were respected professionals with mastery of their subject mentor and excellent explanatory and mentoring skills? I think this could be much better than having tons and tons of crappy, underpaid teachers who don't like their jobs. Put them through a rigorous training program like law school or med school that gives them in-depth knowledge in a few interrelated subject areas and in a flipped classroom model let them be mentors, guides, and help students through any struggles they have with material. They should also be connected to their community and resources so that they can facilitate trips to museums, farms, labs, government buildings, tech companies, etc.
12-02-2012 02:12 AM
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Ky Offline
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Post: #33
RE: Maybe We Should Start Something

(12-02-2012 02:12 AM)sneva831 Wrote:  
(11-23-2012 08:54 PM)Potato Wrote:  "Don't look at teachers, or even school administrators, or the government, as the enemy."

dividing students into classes and assigning each class a teacher is much less efficient that making the information available as a single source on the internet (as khan academy does), but it does provide more jobs (millions more), which is of course what they'd care about the most. and sources on the internet such as khan academy has the potential to lower the cost of grade education from $10k per student per year (so about $120,000 k-12 per student), to the cost of a computer and an internet connection per student. so yes it really is our AND the tax payers' interest against the teacher's union's.

What if we had way fewer teachers but they all got paid double what they are paid now and were respected professionals with mastery of their subject mentor and excellent explanatory and mentoring skills? I think this could be much better than having tons and tons of crappy, underpaid teachers who don't like their jobs. Put them through a rigorous training program like law school or med school that gives them in-depth knowledge in a few interrelated subject areas and in a flipped classroom model let them be mentors, guides, and help students through any struggles they have with material. They should also be connected to their community and resources so that they can facilitate trips to museums, farms, labs, government buildings, tech companies, etc.
Definitely a good change from the status quo.

Also, welcome to School Survival.

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12-02-2012 09:00 AM
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MonkeyDerp Offline
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Post: #34
Maybe We Should Start Something

some good ideas here. i'll join in! i'm no good with videos, but i can help promote them... i'll show all my friends, and set the video as the homepage on all the school computers, and other random people's computers i get access to... lol
12-05-2012 05:42 AM
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Jasterfarian Offline
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Post: #35
Maybe We Should Start Something

what we need is an f'in politician
12-05-2012 05:49 AM
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Bob42 Offline
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Post: #36
RE: Maybe We Should Start Something

Video is a great idea. I can help however you want.
12-05-2012 10:36 AM
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ThorodonSorrow Offline
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Post: #37
RE: Maybe We Should Start Something

[/Reverse][/Hidden][/Strike]
(11-16-2012 11:07 AM)SubCulture Wrote:  I don't know. I just think we should stop complaining and start reforming. The thing is, WE ARE SO CLOSE. And yet, so far. Pretty much EVERYONE that's in school hates it, but they've been told all their lives that school is good. It terrible!! Maybe i'm being too optimistic, but I think we can DO SOMETHING to get the ball rolling. Just one little thing; a boycott, a protest, a damn FACEBOOK POST can erupt into a revolution. Maybe I'm crazy, but it isn't hopeless. We just need to do something.


11/17- Wow. Someone put this as important? Thank you!!!

It's not that I'm saying that I like school all the much, but it isn't really that bad. However, if we drop out enough, and get our GED's when we're all 18, then we'd definitely make a start to a new revolution.

School does however bring us together, right? I think it should be a choice.
I'm dropping out and working full time soon so I can support myself. I don't want to be around the highschool drama bullshit that there is here in Seattle. I've got no place to go but forward.

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12-08-2012 08:25 AM
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timf Offline
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Post: #38
RE: Maybe We Should Start Something

Quote:but I think we can DO SOMETHING to get the ball rolling.

Education is a machine. Even if you gain control or have enough power, it is still a machine. The problem is that it is a machine. If the problem was that it was a broken machine, it might be fixed or changed. However, the real problem is that its very nature is that of a machine.

When we start to think in terms of fighting the machine, taking control of the machine, or even destroying the machine, we get sucked into the machine. A book about a man trying to fight the Roman Army once said that to defeat Rome, you must become Rome. This is why revolutions never seem to make any difference. Like the Who said once, "Meet the new boss, same as the old boss".

The most effective strategy is to escape the machine. This is strangely like the concept of the movie the Matrix except that mastery of the machine is not achievable (to defeat the machine, you must become the machine).

There are those whose nature is inclined against a mechanical existence. A person may be smart, artistic, or just plain independent. For whatever reason, if one cannot survive in the machine, alternatives can be found, slowly move towards the exit. To focus our attention on the machine maintains its power over us.
12-19-2012 05:31 AM
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Ky Offline
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Post: #39
Maybe We Should Start Something

So smashing the machine with a hammer doesn't work?

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12-19-2012 09:34 AM
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timf Offline
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Post: #40
RE: Maybe We Should Start Something

Quote:So smashing the machine with a hammer doesn't work?

If you have a small hammer, your efforts will tie you to the machine.
If you have a hammer large enough to be a threat, you will be crushed.
If you have the biggest hammer, you are the new machine.

Prior to our modern age and the tools of tracking and control that exist, probably the highest level of "machine society" that was achieved was in feudal Japan. The book Shogun describes some of this life. To escape the machine you might consider the history of various underground movements. Japan had people who were "secret" Christians for over 200 years.

There can be little "victories". You can free yourself from the machine. You can find a friend who also wishes freedom. You might even find a sympathetic teacher. Although it is difficult to persuade teachers and parents of the dangers of the machine in that they are so much invested in it. They represent your future if you cannot free yourself from the machine.

Like prisoners of all ages there are many who can see the prison, fewer who want to escape, and fewer still who attempt it. There are even some who pass through the machine without being permanently damaged by it.

The purpose of the machine is to imprint the people it processes such that they will defend and propagate the machine. They provide the next generation for the machine to process. An entire society of several generations has come into existence where the idea of life without a machine is unimaginable. As children grow out of the school machine, they enter the work machine, government machine, and even church machine. It is really all the same machine.

There is life outside the machine. One has to be careful to avoid the traps that are set to bring you back into the machine. If you buy a new car or house or get a student loan, the debt trap will drag you into trying to work your way up the machine ladder to get enough money to pay your debts.
12-20-2012 02:07 AM
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Alistoriv Offline
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Post: #41
Maybe We Should Start Something

What we need is definetly a group. Not only do we need someone doing something newsworthy, the most important thing here is that we are organised. Nobody will ever take us seriously otherwise.
01-18-2013 02:05 PM
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up all night got demons to fight Offline
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Post: #42
RE: Maybe We Should Start Something

(11-16-2012 11:40 AM)SubCulture Wrote:  I got it. We need someone famous. An author, a musician, maybe even a martyr. We need someone to get up into the mainstream and preach. That person doesn't need to preach from the get go; S/he needs to get popular first and pander to impressionable teens. Once that person is at their PEAK, we lay it on them. We can't make the sheep leave the flock on their own, but we CAN change the shepherd. But alas, what are the chances of that happening?

Anyone else have any ideas?

A lot of musicians hated school. Maybe everyone should just listen to the Slim Shady LP...



(This post was last modified: 04-26-2013 12:34 AM by up all night got demons to fight.)
04-26-2013 12:31 AM
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Trekkie_Aspie Offline
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Post: #43
RE: Maybe We Should Start Something

We need a wiki, and just tweet it everywhere.

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stupid article
05-16-2013 03:07 AM
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brainiac3397 Offline
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Post: #44
Maybe We Should Start Something

Agreed. Wikis work wonders.

They just require manpower and effort to make and sustain/expand.

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(06-14-2013 08:02 AM)Potato Wrote:  watch the fuq out, we've got an "intellectual" over here.

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05-16-2013 05:11 AM
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Ky Offline
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Post: #45
Maybe We Should Start Something

Hey guys. I just came up with a completely original idea, made it up completely by myself, with no help at all!

Maybe...maybe we should start something!

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05-16-2013 08:58 AM
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SoulRiser Offline
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Post: #46
Maybe We Should Start Something

We have a wiki already.

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05-16-2013 09:07 AM
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Trekkie_Aspie Offline
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Post: #47
RE: Maybe We Should Start Something

Yeh .. but that only works if people come here... I meant, more like on wetpaint or something.

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stupid article
05-16-2013 09:09 AM
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xcriteria Offline
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Post: #48
Maybe We Should Start Something

Followup wall of content that links back to here: http://forums.school-survival.net/showth...#pid490499

Looking through the wiki, there's a lot of good stuff there, but there's also a lot of stuff to be added. Smile

Coursera and similar MOOCs, the education-related MOOCs (LCL, DNLE, Edstartup 101), credentialing/portfolio sites like Accredible and Degreed.

I can add some things, but the question of making this resource more accessible is something to consider. I've had several adults I've shown this site to find the white-on-black hard to read and sort of dark. Is it a matter of where the wiki is (wetpaint) or is it a matter of color scheme?

I'm also working on developing a class and a documentary (to be determined where the overlap is) to help inform people about both the problems and opportunities of education and learning and life in the modern world. There are lots of single posts and incidents, but weaving them together into a coherent presentation and discussion is the thing that I think will really get people to take steps to changing things.

More ideas?

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05-30-2013 05:24 PM
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Subb Offline
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Post: #49
Maybe We Should Start Something

I have another idea. It could be used on it's own, or as a supplement to the documentary/Kony styled video.

Usually, the media is very refined. It's careful of what comes on air. There's one form of media that isn't that way, though. YouTube. In fact, there are many vloggers who would love a movement like this. All we need to do is find them and get them to inform the masses. Then, we would have a wider audience from the start. I already know of a few:

TheAmazingAtheist has talked about how bad the school system is.
Pogobat has made many videos about how he would change the school system.
MrRepzion made a video praising Jeff Bliss, and talked about the low quality of teachers. (the video has been removed by him.)
Nerdcubed has talked about school once.

That's all I know now. Feel free to shoot them an email telling them about this site.

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(This post was last modified: 05-31-2013 01:22 PM by Subb.)
05-31-2013 03:32 AM
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SoulRiser Offline
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Post: #50
Maybe We Should Start Something

Quote:I can add some things, but the question of making this resource more accessible is something to consider. I've had several adults I've shown this site to find the white-on-black hard to read and sort of dark.
There's a theme changer in the right sidebar. Smile

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05-31-2013 05:04 AM
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xcriteria Offline
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Post: #51
Maybe We Should Start Something

(05-31-2013 05:04 AM)SoulRiser Wrote:  
Quote:I can add some things, but the question of making this resource more accessible is something to consider. I've had several adults I've shown this site to find the white-on-black hard to read and sort of dark.
There's a theme changer in the right sidebar. Smile

Is there a way to apply that to the forums? (Printable Version is white, but the layout is kind of strange.)

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RE: Maybe We Should Start Something

(05-31-2013 06:11 AM)xcriteria Wrote:  Is there a way to apply that to the forums? (Printable Version is white, but the layout is kind of strange.)

Nope, it's a totally different system.

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06-02-2013 06:43 AM
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Post: #53
Maybe We Should Start Something

All of you have great ideas, and seem very motivated.

So to answer this Threads Question simply, Lets get started.
I'm planning on holding a think-tank conversation for those concerned about Public Education and want to make a Change.

A bit about myself, I'm Justin from Voices of Educational Revolution, A new Start up into the world of "Reformation/Revolution."
We believe, in a nutshell, in Transformation for the Students and by the Students.
The Key is Voices.
By Combining the Resources of those who are interested, we hope to build a force of those who can Think, Speak, and Do.

For more information about VERevolution and it's immediate plans take a peek at this post,
http://forums.school-survival.net/showth...?tid=29307

I hope that all of you can elaborate more on your ideas here, in a Skype Conversation.
PM me a Skype Username, or Email: VERpowered@gmail.com

Regards and Good Luck

- Justin

Want to make a Change?
http://forums.school-survival.net/showth...?tid=29307
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07-04-2013 02:42 PM
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Post: #54
Maybe We Should Start Something

What is a Positive School Climate?
A positive school climate exists when
all students feel comfortable, wanted,
valued, accepted, and secure in an
environment where they can interact
with caring people they trust.
A positive school climate affects
everyone associated with the school –
students, staff, parents, and the
community. It is the belief system or
culture that underlies the day-to-day operation of a school.
Improved school climate is a goal to pursue. Educators need to constantly work
toward improving their school climate, culture, and conditions so that student
learning is improved.
Environmental or School Climate Surveys
Environmental or school climate surveys (scans or assessments) are often
conducted to review the factors in the school or classroom that might influence
a student’s overall functioning. The surveys can be conducted at the school or
classroom level and involve students, staff, parents, community members, and
school administrators.
The data collected should be used to begin a dialogue among the school’s
stakeholders for the purpose of moving towards meaningful change.

Read more...
10-05-2013 03:15 PM
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Post: #55
RE: Maybe We Should Start Something

What about our own e-learning place?

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stupid article
11-23-2013 03:21 AM
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Gwedin Offline
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Post: #56
Maybe We Should Start Something

You forgot a fullstop. I am under the impression that your organisation is very unprofessional.

idk :|
12-10-2013 08:54 PM
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Post: #57
Maybe We Should Start Something

Their tutors would benefit from another lesson in grammar.

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12-11-2013 02:05 AM
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Post: #58
RE: Maybe We Should Start Something

(12-10-2013 08:04 PM)homeworkly Wrote:  Get help in your homework, essays and many more from our tutors

LOL ADBOT.

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12-11-2013 10:32 AM
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Trar Away
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Post: #59
Maybe We Should Start Something

In my view, the SS wiki could do with a general overview on the history of public education, and a comprehensive list of its faults. Also, it could do with some MAJOR maintenance. Maybe even a site change. I recall seeing an off-site wiki a long time ago.

I mean just look at the Montessori page. That is shameful.
12-14-2013 03:11 PM
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xcriteria Offline
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RE: Maybe We Should Start Something

(12-14-2013 03:11 PM)Trar Wrote:  In my view, the SS wiki could do with a general overview on the history of public education, and a comprehensive list of its faults. Also, it could do with some MAJOR maintenance. Maybe even a site change. I recall seeing an off-site wiki a long time ago.

Yeah. One way to provide an overview is to link to some key talks, like Ken Robinson's Changing Education Paradigms. I think it's important to show not just the history, but current players and narratives, since the future of education is very much in an active state of transformation.

One example is looking Bill Gates and Dianne Ravitch, who are often represented as adversaries in the press... here's one bit on this topic, Ravitch answering questions posed by Gates:

Ravitch answers Gates

[Image: full_1291146855gates-ravitch.jpg]

But, as Steve Hargadon puts it, in many ways these two broad positions of backing high-stakes testing, shutting down bad schools, firing bad teachers, and seeking to improve teachers (Gates), and defending public education and teachers against the onslaught of testing (Ravitch), both have a number of common denominators. Meanwhile, I think both of them have good intentions and believe in improving education.

See Steve Hargadon's article, Hacking at the Roots of the Learning Revolution, and the subsequent Hangout-on-Air (HoA) on that topic (Changing Education By Hacking At the Roots, Not the Branches with Howard Rheingold, Audrey Watters and a few others.)



Watch on YouTube

It takes time to dig through all these articles, watch hour-long conversations, follow threads and figure out what it all means... but there must be some way to help people learn about some of the key factors in all of this.

I think something more dynamic than just a wiki is needed... something with the energy and momentum of a course, game, or interactive series. Some of the MOOCs I've taken part in like Ed Startup 101 and Designing a New Learning Environment (DNLE) and Learning Creative Learning (LCL) had some of that, but none of them really connected deeply into the themes and scenarios that come up on School Survival.

So, maybe we should start something that draws from those, but also involves the concept of putting together a series and writing books like some of us have talked about.

(12-14-2013 03:11 PM)Trar Wrote:  I mean just look at the Montessori page. That is shameful.

Looks like it was spammed. SoulRiser's last change in the history has a coherent version, but this is a symptom of a larger problem.

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12-16-2013 04:48 AM
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