Why, why, why

[RandomTroll]

Why do people do things that they hate, why? Why not just stand up for yourself. I know that for example in school when you stand up alone, nothing will happen, you will just get in trouble, but why so many "play by the rules" in school? When asked do you like school, many reply "no", but when asked why you do it, why you try to get higher pointless numbers and letter that are supposed to show how well you absorb information, most reply "Because I have to". I never understood "Because I have to", no you don't.
Why do we learn things that are completely useless, such as structure of a plant or radio wave frequency, that stuff should be tough for biochemists or electronics engineers that use this stuff to build upon. Or a foreign language that you absolutely hate and will never use EVER.
Why aren't we tough some useful life skills such as cooking, first aid, basic car/bike/whatever maintenance, sewing (stop laughing, this is a useful skill), driving.
Why is acting different considered a sickness, that should be "cured" (adhd, add and other stuff). Kids are bored, that's why they talk during the lesson, make airplanes, drawing stuff in the notebook.
Why can't I work with friends during the lessons, you can learn more when you work in groups (most of the time).
Why are my basic needs restricted in school.
Why school = prison.
Why Prison is better than school ( see this pic)
Why don't we stand up, why we wait, why we are being shat on and still asking for more, by the teachers, by the staff, by the parents, by the SOCIETY.
Why do I have to waste 36 hrs/week (not counting homework) on a system that is broken, I could learn so much more about a subject that has to do with my future AND BLOODY INTERESTS ME.
Why do we have so little time for ourselves, we are people, we have lives too you know.
Why any form of fun is banned in schools?
Why aren't we in control of our futures, why do we have to go the same path? We are all different, we have different needs, different hobbies, different likes and dislikes.
Why are we, antischoolers, not afraid to stand up for ourselves, to risk as some see, our futures, our lives?
Why people overemphasis money, it's not the most important thing in the world.

If you read till here, than I thank you for reading my mid-night rants. I'm staring to feel more depressed every day.

[AWOL]

They teach you basic biology and physics to let you see if it interests you. They don't teach you all that crap because by all rights school should be purely academic and your parents should take the responsibility to teach you that stuff.

[Miller0700]

It's gonna take time, optimism, effort and persistence to change these things but people just don't want to the put the time, energy and passion into it.

[HeartofShadows]

(10-17-2011 07:00 AM)Derchin Wrote:  It's gonna take time, optimism, effort and persistence to change these things but people just don't want to the put the time, energy and passion into it.

Yeah its a world where dogs would rather eat each other rather than work together in this cage.

[.Manicrose.]

Because people care about nothing but money, money that determines everything, especially a person's value. It's easier to lump everyone together in one category than pay attention to their specific personalities, needs, abilities...who fucking cares? If you're working at a company as a faceless automaton your personality doesn't matter. I hate it too.

[SoulRiser]

Fear of going against the norm, of doing things that will make people think you're weird... fear that you actually will end up homeless or working at McDonalds if you don't do well in school. Fear that your parents will disown you and throw you out... fear that your friends will ditch you 'cause they don't understand you. Basically, it all kinda boils down to fear.

So... what are you gonna do 'bout it?

"Courage is resistance to fear, mastery of fear, not absence of fear." - Mark Twain

[UnschoolShqiponjë]

(10-17-2011 06:59 AM)AWOL Wrote:  They teach you basic biology and physics to let you see if it interests you. They don't teach you all that crap because by all rights school should be purely academic and your parents should take the responsibility to teach you that stuff.

What a stupid reason to teach something in school. School is fucking stupid currently and needs a total reform.

[Efs]

I only go to school because I can't go to University without it. And a lot of jobs require a degree.
Fuck the system.

[RandomTroll]

(10-17-2011 09:34 AM)SoulRiser Wrote:  Fear of going against the norm, of doing things that will make people think you're weird... fear that you actually will end up homeless or working at McDonalds if you don't do well in school. Fear that your parents will disown you and throw you out... fear that your friends will ditch you 'cause they don't understand you. Basically, it all kinda boils down to fear.

But what kind of friends are they? Real friends accept for what you are, in times like these, you find out who to call friend and who to avoid.

[SoulRiser]

Agreed. But a lot of people are afraid of losing their friends, even if those friends wouldn't leave them anyway. And if they would, people are afraid to find that out.

[Elfy]

I think you need to ask yourself why you do things you don't want to. I'll try and be a bit more philosophical, since this is in the philosophy section.

You may think people don't have power over you, but lets define power. Power means someone is able to make you do something you don't want to do. In this case, you are letting people have power over you.

To overcome not doing things you don't want to do, it is fundamental to accept that people have power over you. Once you accept it, you know what you are facing and you can remove that power someone has over you. If you deny that someone has power over you then you can't work towards removing it. Get my drift?

The first steps towards more freedom, is taking your own steps.

Money isn't the most important thing in the world, I'll agree with that, but it's not to say money isn't powerful. Money = Power, and if you have a lot of power...

Understand that you are a collection of atoms which are going to return to nature some time in the next 80 years or so. A soul is debateable but I won't go into it. Anywho, I hope that fact encourages you to do what you want, you are completely free to do so.

It's just someone with power may argue that you're not free, and it's hard to argue with someone who has a lot of power. You need a strong mentality about you.

Test yourself, don't go to school tomorrow if you don't want to. Chances are you will go, ask yourself what is stopping you? And essentially, it won't boil down to fear or anything of that sort, it's down to you.

[RandomTroll]

(10-18-2011 04:00 AM)Elfy Wrote:  I think you need to ask yourself why you do things you don't want to. I'll try and be a bit more philosophical, since this is in the philosophy section.

You may think people don't have power over you, but lets define power. Power means someone is able to make you do something you don't want to do. In this case, you are letting people have power over you.

To overcome not doing things you don't want to do, it is fundamental to accept that people have power over you. Once you accept it, you know what you are facing and you can remove that power someone has over you. If you deny that someone has power over you then you can't work towards removing it. Get my drift?

The first steps towards more freedom, is taking your own steps.

Money isn't the most important thing in the world, I'll agree with that, but it's not to say money isn't powerful. Money = Power, and if you have a lot of power...

Understand that you are a collection of atoms which are going to return to nature some time in the next 80 years or so. A soul is debateable but I won't go into it. Anywho, I hope that fact encourages you to do what you want, you are completely free to do so.

It's just someone with power may argue that you're not free, and it's hard to argue with someone who has a lot of power. You need a strong mentality about you.

Test yourself, don't go to school tomorrow if you don't want to. Chances are you will go, ask yourself what is stopping you? And essentially, it won't boil down to fear or anything of that sort, it's down to you.

Very great post, Elfy, but ...

Quote:Test yourself, don't go to school tomorrow if you don't want to. Chances are you will go, ask yourself what is stopping you? And essentially, it won't boil down to fear or anything of that sort, it's down to you.

Yes I will go, I fear my parents, this is the main reason that i go (other reasons include a special someone, who i see only in school, but she is one of those nerdy types, i won't go into that), i fear my parents, they won't understand why I don't go to school, why do I hate it, why do I reject it.

[Elfy]

You may fear your parents, but you are the only thing stopping yourself from going. Fear of parents is a psychological thing, if you don't go and thoroughly explain why you don't want to go and why you and they should reject it then anything after that is their problem. I can sympathise with you, dealing with your parents isn't an easy thing, but it's not impossible. Ultimately it's your life and you are your own dictator and sometimes you gotta take the bull by its horns. No one else can make the decision for you, so doing nothing will = nothing.

Okay, so you fear your parents. What is the worst your parents will do?

[Efs]

I agree...
Elfy, I fear of my parents too. If I don't go, they'll take away everything I have and won't talk to me. And I love them, it's the ONLY reason I go.

[AWOL]

> Exposing people to basic science
> Showing them secular reasoning
> Showing them empirical evidence
> Religious country
> Bad idea

Fucking what?

[UnschoolShqiponjë]

What about the kids who are not religious? Even if they are you think some forced school classes are going to stop their parent's indoctrination?

[HeartofShadows]

>Believe you have a right to hang out at the gym with everybody else.
>Go there to prove a point to yourself.
>Get beat up by the popular gangsta kids.
>Bleed on the ground.

[AWOL]

No, but showing kids an alternative to the just plain retarded things that parents seem intent on shoving down their throats is always a good thing. I'm all for giving them a greater choice, or letting them drop out a fair bit earlier than they're allowed to at the moment, but they definitely need something to get them away from their folks.

[SoulRiser]

What if their parents are actually super awesome? (Rare, but it happens).

And srsly, there are soooo many other ways kids can get away from their parents... that just totally doesn't justify compulsory schooling at all.

[Spiritus_Raptor]

(10-18-2011 06:26 AM)Elfy Wrote:  Okay, so you fear your parents. What is the worst your parents will do?

Beat me, take away my things, not talk to me, drag me by my collar to school, put me under medication, put me in Juvenal Detention, can't imagine it would go much farther from there.

[UnschoolShqiponjë]

(10-19-2011 06:56 AM)AWOL Wrote:  No, but showing kids an alternative to the just plain retarded things that parents seem intent on shoving down their throats is always a good thing. I'm all for giving them a greater choice, or letting them drop out a fair bit earlier than they're allowed to at the moment, but they definitely need something to get them away from their folks.

Agreed, schooling is important. It just needs great reform. It needs to be based more on natural learning. Do you know how many religious kids were incredibly interested when I told them about the theory of evolution? That is cool and interesting. It also makes sense. I didn't have to force it on them at all.

[Spiritus_Raptor]

(10-19-2011 12:23 PM)UnschoolShqiponjë Wrote:  

(10-19-2011 06:56 AM)AWOL Wrote:  No, but showing kids an alternative to the just plain retarded things that parents seem intent on shoving down their throats is always a good thing. I'm all for giving them a greater choice, or letting them drop out a fair bit earlier than they're allowed to at the moment, but they definitely need something to get them away from their folks.

Agreed, schooling is important. It just needs great reform. It needs to be based more on natural learning. Do you know how many religious kids were incredibly interested when I told them about the theory of evolution? That is cool and interesting. It also makes sense. I didn't have to force it on them at all.

Unfortunately I doubt this will happen soon. I can't even come up with a reason we're scared of doing it.

Hating school has a rather universal taboo in which it's considered immature and angsty. Which means more than likely if it's brought up in normal conversation it will be quickly dismissed.

[UnschoolShqiponjë]

(10-21-2011 03:20 AM)Spiritus_Raptor Wrote:  

(10-19-2011 12:23 PM)UnschoolShqiponjë Wrote:  

(10-19-2011 06:56 AM)AWOL Wrote:  No, but showing kids an alternative to the just plain retarded things that parents seem intent on shoving down their throats is always a good thing. I'm all for giving them a greater choice, or letting them drop out a fair bit earlier than they're allowed to at the moment, but they definitely need something to get them away from their folks.

Agreed, schooling is important. It just needs great reform. It needs to be based more on natural learning. Do you know how many religious kids were incredibly interested when I told them about the theory of evolution? That is cool and interesting. It also makes sense. I didn't have to force it on them at all.

Unfortunately I doubt this will happen soon. I can't even come up with a reason we're scared of doing it.

Hating school has a rather universal taboo in which it's considered immature and angsty. Which means more than likely if it's brought up in normal conversation it will be quickly dismissed.

Well I will make it happen for my kids. They will be unschooled and if they want they can go to school but they will not be forced.

[Spiritus_Raptor]

(10-21-2011 03:23 AM)UnschoolShqiponjë Wrote:  Well I will make it happen for my kids. They will be unschooled and if they want they can go to school but they will not be forced.

Regular schooling has offered me many of my closest friends I have today. It has also caused some memories of boyfriends and girlfriends that give me happy thoughts.

At the same time, school has caused me to put up with some of the most vile and pathetic excuses for human beings I've ever had the rather unfortunate luck to witness.

At the same time, school has also been the staging grounds for magnificent teachers, one in particular, stressed the importance of not believing everything you see in the school books, of going beyond the cover. It has allowed me to become interested in things I would have never dreamed of.

It has also forced me to work with some infuriating people, of which have made me discover new levels of frustration and anger, tugging at the fabric of my sanity, ripping and tearing it, causing me to skirt the edge of madness for a good while.

Overall, school can be wonderful, for me, girlfriends and boyfriends, wonderful teachers, friends.
It can also bring untold hate, that no one, should ever have to put through.

To me, it's been worth it. The good memories surprisingly outweigh the bad. It depends on the person. I would strongly encourage kids to try a year in middle school, then decide whether they wanted to stay in compulsory schooling, or, like I wish I had the chance to, unschool.

[UnschoolShqiponjë]

Forgive my blind hatred but I strongly feel you were either really lucky or you are looking at your experience through rose colored glasses. Great friends, bf/gf's, mentors (teachers), etc. are all just as possible without school.

[Spiritus_Raptor]

(10-21-2011 11:42 AM)UnschoolShqiponjë Wrote:  Forgive my blind hatred but I strongly feel you were either really lucky or you are looking at your experience through rose colored glasses. Great friends, bf/gf's, mentors (teachers), etc. are all just as possible without school.

I fancy myself very lucky. The mind-clouding rage I have experienced is nothing against goofing off in classes, talking with friends, sometimes I can't wait to go to school, sometimes I dread it.

[UnschoolShqiponjë]

(10-21-2011 10:36 PM)Spiritus_Raptor Wrote:  

(10-21-2011 11:42 AM)UnschoolShqiponjë Wrote:  Forgive my blind hatred but I strongly feel you were either really lucky or you are looking at your experience through rose colored glasses. Great friends, bf/gf's, mentors (teachers), etc. are all just as possible without school.

I fancy myself very lucky. The mind-clouding rage I have experienced is nothing against goofing off in classes, talking with friends, sometimes I can't wait to go to school, sometimes I dread it.

I will not lie, sometimes I think back about high school and chilling in the alcove with my friends playing Magic: The Gathering and talking about video games. I won't lie I did have fun at times. I'd just rather give my kids a choice.

[SoulRiser]

I met all my good friends either after school or in college. With that said, the actual college classes I attended were pretty much useless. I did learn a lot in school though, but most of it wasn't part of the curriculum.

Choice is always good though.