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Rastko · 02-08-2011 02:20 AM

Absentinsomniac Wrote:^ Better yet, online lessons that don't require any video contact with teachers... That's what my friend does, and I'd rather do that...

Why don't you if you are able to?

@Lunatic - Lulz, homeschooling is a terribly bad idea. A sad minority of parents are not oppressive, so homeschooling could not be implemented universally or at majority.

Absnt · 02-08-2011 12:56 PM

Rastko Wrote:
Absentinsomniac Wrote:^ Better yet, online lessons that don't require any video contact with teachers... That's what my friend does, and I'd rather do that...

Why don't you if you are able to?

My dad would never allow it, and I'm already a junior, so I can probably stick it out for another year and a half.

Prince Rilian · 02-08-2011 01:16 PM

Rastko Wrote:@Lunatic - Lulz, homeschooling is a terribly bad idea.

Shut your face, homeschooling is awesome. It allowed me to escape the hell of school for a couple of years.

Absnt · 02-08-2011 01:18 PM

^Agreed.

Although I kind of agree that some parents are fucking assholes and will teach their kids their own beliefs and won't expose them to anything but what they think...

Prince Rilian · 02-08-2011 02:10 PM

I know it can be bad, but most parents can't compete with the indoctrination powers of school.

Rastko · 02-09-2011 02:16 AM

Prince Rilian Wrote:
Rastko Wrote:@Lunatic - Lulz, homeschooling is a terribly bad idea.
Shut your face, homeschooling is awesome. It allowed me to escape the hell of school for a couple of years.

I didn't say schooling is better then homeschooling. I don't think so, I think schooling is far worse, but that does not make homeschooling anything good. It is still a terrible idea which gives parent all power. And it's not like it "can" be bad, there's hardly any case in which parent is not authoritarian GOP bastard from the Bible Belt.

Prince Rilian · 02-09-2011 03:18 AM

Rastko Wrote:
Prince Rilian Wrote:
Rastko Wrote:@Lunatic - Lulz, homeschooling is a terribly bad idea.
Shut your face, homeschooling is awesome. It allowed me to escape the hell of school for a couple of years.

I didn't say schooling is better then homeschooling. I don't think so, I think schooling is far worse, but that does not make homeschooling anything good. It is still a terrible idea which gives parent all power. And it's not like it "can" be bad, there's hardly any case in which parent is not authoritarian GOP bastard from the Bible Belt.

I just gave you an example tard. I was "homeschooled" for two years and my parents left me the fuck alone. Same with my brother who has been homeschooled for 7 years now.

I was in a homeschooling club a while ago, and those people, the other teenagers, were so much fucking nicer than the ones from public school, because their lives are better and they aren't angry all the time and lashing out at everyone around them. Half of them weren't religious, by the way, even though the parents were. Get that? Religious parents homeschooling their kids, and the kids quit the religion and became atheists or agnostics. Not everyone in the group but like half of them.

The only time homeschooling is bad is when the parents are more abusive than the school. That's rare. That takes a parent who beats you with a hammer or rapes you or starves you, and happily most parents do not do that shit.

I have these two cousins who are homeschooled by batshit christians. But they are happier and smarter (i.e., they can make better use of their brains) than kids who are public schooled or done to in any similar way (like a private school that's just like a typical public school).

For some people, school is better than home. That's not most people.

**SoulRiser** · 02-09-2011 03:28 AM

I'd say 90% of the time homeschooling > schooling.

Of course unschooling > homeschooling, but the thing with being homeschooled is, even if your parents are batshit crazy religious nutcases, at least you know your 'teachers' care about you. They actually care about your future, and your life, and not just some stupid test scores and their job.

Of course there are exceptions like those psychopathic types who beat their kids to death for not counting to 5 properly or some shit... but they're thankfully rare. Saying homeschooling in general is bad because of people like that, is like saying video games are bad because the Columbine killers played video games. The two are completely unrelated.

Psycho parents like that would probably find some other bullshit excuse to kill their kids even if they didn't homeschool them.

Prince Rilian · 02-09-2011 12:58 PM

I was actually unschooled for those two years.

My brother isn't technically unschooled, but he has always been in charge of what books he uses, what he does with them, and what grades he gets at the end of each "class".

Rastko · 02-10-2011 02:00 AM

Prince Rilian Wrote:I was actually unschooled for those two years.

My brother isn't technically unschooled, but he has always been in charge of what books he uses, what he does with them, and what grades he gets at the end of each "class".

Unschooling is somewhat better, but still it gives parent more rights then he or she is entitled to. I think Government shall give all citizens free internet access and regard it as basic human right and then enable virtual education for everyone.

Prince Rilian · 02-10-2011 02:21 AM

Rastko Wrote:
Prince Rilian Wrote:I was actually unschooled for those two years.

My brother isn't technically unschooled, but he has always been in charge of what books he uses, what he does with them, and what grades he gets at the end of each "class".

Unschooling is somewhat better,

What in the hell do you want? You hate school, don't you? Unschooling is the complete lack of school. It's not "somewhat better". It's THE best. It's 100% respectful.

Quote:but still it gives parent more rights then he or she is entitled to.

What the hell are you talking about? Unschooling does not give parents any more "rights" than the government-gang has already granted them otherwise.

Quote:I think Government shall give all citizens free internet access and regard it as basic human right and then enable virtual education for everyone.

You worship the government-gang? I can't imagine why else you capitalize its evil name.

The internet can be useful, for sure. But I think you have a warped idea of what education is. Education is not that shit that happens in school, nor any simulation of it. Real education is living in a community and learning to do things within it, and to add your own contribution. I recommend you read the book Homeschooling Our Children, Unschooling Ourselves by Alison McKee so that you can have a better understanding of what real learning/living is.

Here's the amazon page for it http://www.amazon.com/Homeschooling-Our ... 0965780627

Rastko · 02-10-2011 04:43 AM

Calm down, dude. I am speaking from the US point of view. Of course that in the countries like Sweden, Finland, The Netherlands etc unschooling is a lot better option, but wait... USA? Country in which physically assaulting your child is legal in all 50 states? In which barbaric practice of "washing mouth with soap" and similar primitive rituals are encouraged? No way. It's more secure to be treated in Government-organized school, then in school in which someone may physically assault me. Yes, I know, corporal punishment in schools is also legal in over 20 US states, but I am also speaking from the point of view of someone living in New York, Vermont, New Hampshire and other unchurched liberal east coast states. Therefore, unschooling can be dangerous because of how many rights it gives to a parent. Easily, it can become even worse then schooling. Therefore, first Government shall take away "right" to abuse other individual and then we can talk about such stuff.

**SoulRiser** · 02-10-2011 04:55 AM

A parent who actually is willing to let a kid be unschooled isn't going to abuse them or do any of that crazy shit because they're too smart for that.

Some of those crazy types might homeschool their kids though.

Unschooling... homeschooling... 2 different things.

Rastko · 02-10-2011 05:35 AM

SoulRiser Wrote:A parent who actually is willing to let a kid be unschooled isn't going to abuse them or do any of that crazy shit because they're too smart for that.

Some of those crazy types might homeschool their kids though.

Unschooling... homeschooling... 2 different things.

Actually, only difference is that homeschooling is regulated by the Government, child is tested etc. while in unschooling there are no Government's regulations. That doesn't depend on a parent, but on the Government's policy.

Prince Rilian · 02-10-2011 06:19 AM

Rastko Wrote:
SoulRiser Wrote:A parent who actually is willing to let a kid be unschooled isn't going to abuse them or do any of that crazy shit because they're too smart for that.

Some of those crazy types might homeschool their kids though.

Unschooling... homeschooling... 2 different things.

Actually, only difference is that homeschooling is regulated by the Government, child is tested etc.

WRONG. Boy you sure are ignorant.

Ugh. I will come back later and make a post trying to explain this to you. Right now I'm still reeling from how badly confused you are.

Prince Rilian · 02-10-2011 06:22 AM

Rastko Wrote:Therefore, unschooling can be dangerous because of how many rights it gives to a parent.

Your parents could still beat you after school. I see what your concern is now, though. You're worried about the crazies who keep their kids locked in a closet, and since they are "homeschooling" them, no one ever sees the kid and no one ever figures out that anything is wrong.

Absnt · 02-10-2011 06:25 AM

Prince Rilian Wrote:
Rastko Wrote:Therefore, unschooling can be dangerous because of how many rights it gives to a parent.
Your parents could still beat you after school. I see what your concern is now, though. You're worried about the crazies who keep their kids locked in a closet, and since they are "homeschooling" them, no one ever sees the kid and no one ever figures out that anything is wrong.

Of course, a crazy parent could do that either way... If they are that crazy, what's stopping them from just not sending their kids to school in the first place? There are ways around it even in countries that require public schooling.

Rastko · 02-10-2011 06:25 AM

Prince Rilian Wrote:
Rastko Wrote:Therefore, unschooling can be dangerous because of how many rights it gives to a parent.
Your parents could still beat you after school. I see what your concern is now, though. You're worried about the crazies who keep their kids locked in a closet, and since they are "homeschooling" them, no one ever sees the kid and no one ever figures out that anything is wrong.

Well it is more likely that such a creature would beat a child while he or she studies. So such situations would be more frequent while homeschooling. And yes, parents could make tradition even longer by indoctrinating children that way. I don't say state schooling is not indoctrinating, but homeschooling could be far worse. So, it's still a huge danger.

Absnt · 02-10-2011 06:26 AM

Ninja'd.

Prince Rilian · 02-10-2011 06:27 AM

Rastko Wrote:
Prince Rilian Wrote:
Rastko Wrote:Therefore, unschooling can be dangerous because of how many rights it gives to a parent.
Your parents could still beat you after school. I see what your concern is now, though. You're worried about the crazies who keep their kids locked in a closet, and since they are "homeschooling" them, no one ever sees the kid and no one ever figures out that anything is wrong.

Well it is more likely that such a creature would beat a child while he or she studies. So such situations would be more frequent while homeschooling. And yes, parents could make tradition even longer by indoctrinating children that way. I don't say state schooling is not indoctrinating, but homeschooling could be far worse. So, it's still a huge danger.

I get the distinct impression you pull this shit out of your butt.

magikarp · 02-10-2011 06:29 AM

Rastko Wrote:And it's not like it "can" be bad, there's hardly any case in which parent is not authoritarian GOP bastard from the Bible Belt.

That's not always true outside of the US, though. Most of the homeschoolers I know are either kind of hippies or their kids had a particularly hard time at school due to a learning disability or something.

Absnt · 02-10-2011 06:33 AM

magikarp Wrote:
Rastko Wrote:And it's not like it "can" be bad, there's hardly any case in which parent is not authoritarian GOP bastard from the Bible Belt.
That's not ~~always~~ true

Fixed. I know lots of home schoolers who aren't religious in the least.

**SoulRiser** · 02-10-2011 06:45 AM

I think overall, homeschooling does more good than harm. The crazies will find ways to do their crazy shit regardless. It's not homeschooling's fault that they exist.

Prince Rilian · 02-10-2011 07:07 AM

So.

Unschooling. It is a term coined by John Holt, meant to denote the idea of a complete lack of school. You're not doing school at home. You're not giving your kids lists to memorize and quizzing them. You're just living, and your kids are just living.

But there's a problem. The problem isn't with life, the problem is with this stupid gang sticking guns in your face and saying you've got to do such and such to your children. You're trying to respect your children, but the gang says you have to stick your genitals all over them and make them memorize plant names and how to put an equation in point-slope form.

That doesn't happen everywhere, but it happens in a lot of places. Like, in the farms in that area called "new england", the north-eastern part of the america-farm, the tendency is that you have to purchase a government-gang-sanctioned curriculum, and send in stupid worksheets to be graded. And if you try to respect your children (by not doing school at all, a.k.a unschooling), the government-gang will throw you in a cage and then rape your children.

Happily, in the farm called "texas", the gang isn't so crazy about that particular kind of rape. Homeschooling is considered by the farmers to be a kind of private school and therefore not subject to any kind of regulation or investigation. In texas, you don't have to fill out any forms, or make your kids take any tests. Unschooling, not doing school at all, is technically illegal, but, crucially, it is illegal for the government-gang to check up on you and make sure you're doing it. It's kinda weird, but I don't give a shit, I'm just glad I was able to not do school for a couple of years. Oklahoma is pretty much the same. I don't know the specifics, but there's no government body that goes around checking up on homeschooling families. In Arkansas, you're supposed to fill out a form and take a biannual test, but they don't come check to see that you are forcing your child to memorize shit or whatever, and they don't even really check up on the paperwork or testing, so you can just skip it. Also, the test doesn't matter anyway, they don't require you to "pass" it or anything, just take it. But like I said, they don't come after you if you miss the test.

So basically, homeschooling is the term the government-gang uses to refer to people who don't send their kids off to some kind of typical school building.

Unschooling is a complete lack of school, whether in a big prison-like building, or in your living-room. You just don't do it, anywhere or any time.

It's like, if the government-gang said parents have to send their kids off to these buildings to be beaten. But then they said, "Well, you can do the beating at home if you want." And some governments would check up to make sure you were beating them, but some of them wouldn't. And in the places that don't check up, you can just refrain from beating your kids at all, and you don't have to worry about getting in trouble with "the law". And you're saying that you don't like unbeating, because it gives the parents too much control. You'd rather have homebeating, where the government-gang checks up to make sure they are doing it.

See how fucking ridiculous that is?

Rastko · 02-10-2011 10:14 AM

magikarp Wrote:
Rastko Wrote:And it's not like it "can" be bad, there's hardly any case in which parent is not authoritarian GOP bastard from the Bible Belt.
That's not always true outside of the US, though. Most of the homeschoolers I know are either kind of hippies or their kids had a particularly hard time at school due to a learning disability or something.

I highlighted & underlined numerous times that I am talking strictly about USA. Outside USA, especially in Europe, it can be a wonderful idea.

Absnt · 02-10-2011 10:47 AM

Absentinsomniac Wrote:
magikarp Wrote:
Rastko Wrote:And it's not like it "can" be bad, there's hardly any case in which parent is not authoritarian GOP bastard from the Bible Belt.
That's not ~~always~~ true

Fixed. I know lots of home schoolers who aren't religious in the least.

I live in the U.S.

Prince Rilian · 02-10-2011 11:03 AM

Rastko Wrote:
magikarp Wrote:
Rastko Wrote:And it's not like it "can" be bad, there's hardly any case in which parent is not authoritarian GOP bastard from the Bible Belt.
That's not always true outside of the US, though. Most of the homeschoolers I know are either kind of hippies or their kids had a particularly hard time at school due to a learning disability or something.

I highlighted & underlined numerous times that I am talking strictly about USA. Outside USA, especially in Europe, it can be a wonderful idea.

So, what, are the people in usa, like, a different species or something? Why do you insist they are so different from the rest of humans?

Leon Kinotolian · 02-10-2011 11:13 AM

Rastko Wrote:
Prince Rilian Wrote:I highlighted & underlined numerous times that I am talking strictly about USA. Outside USA, especially in Europe, it can be a wonderful idea.
So, what, are the people in usa, like, a different species or something? Why do you insist they are so different from the rest of humans?

I'd like to know the answer to this, too, being an American myself.

Prince Rilian · 02-11-2011 04:16 AM

I guess you agree with this, since you haven't replied to it.

Prince Rilian Wrote:So.

Unschooling. It is a term coined by John Holt, meant to denote the idea of a complete lack of school. You're not doing school at home. You're not giving your kids lists to memorize and quizzing them. You're just living, and your kids are just living.

But there's a problem. The problem isn't with life, the problem is with this stupid gang sticking guns in your face and saying you've got to do such and such to your children. You're trying to respect your children, but the gang says you have to stick your genitals all over them and make them memorize plant names and how to put an equation in point-slope form.

That doesn't happen everywhere, but it happens in a lot of places. Like, in the farms in that area called "new england", the north-eastern part of the america-farm, the tendency is that you have to purchase a government-gang-sanctioned curriculum, and send in stupid worksheets to be graded. And if you try to respect your children (by not doing school at all, a.k.a unschooling), the government-gang will throw you in a cage and then rape your children.

Happily, in the farm called "texas", the gang isn't so crazy about that particular kind of rape. Homeschooling is considered by the farmers to be a kind of private school and therefore not subject to any kind of regulation or investigation. In texas, you don't have to fill out any forms, or make your kids take any tests. Unschooling, not doing school at all, is technically illegal, but, crucially, it is illegal for the government-gang to check up on you and make sure you're doing it. It's kinda weird, but I don't give a shit, I'm just glad I was able to not do school for a couple of years. Oklahoma is pretty much the same. I don't know the specifics, but there's no government body that goes around checking up on homeschooling families. In Arkansas, you're supposed to fill out a form and take a biannual test, but they don't come check to see that you are forcing your child to memorize shit or whatever, and they don't even really check up on the paperwork or testing, so you can just skip it. Also, the test doesn't matter anyway, they don't require you to "pass" it or anything, just take it. But like I said, they don't come after you if you miss the test.

So basically, homeschooling is the term the government-gang uses to refer to people who don't send their kids off to some kind of typical school building.

Unschooling is a complete lack of school, whether in a big prison-like building, or in your living-room. You just don't do it, anywhere or any time.

It's like, if the government-gang said parents have to send their kids off to these buildings to be beaten. But then they said, "Well, you can do the beating at home if you want." And some governments would check up to make sure you were beating them, but some of them wouldn't. And in the places that don't check up, you can just refrain from beating your kids at all, and you don't have to worry about getting in trouble with "the law". And you're saying that you don't like unbeating, because it gives the parents too much control. You'd rather have homebeating, where the government-gang checks up to make sure they are doing it.

See how fucking ridiculous that is?

Rastko · 02-12-2011 01:46 AM

Of course I do, but USA is a sui generis. Most of those who oppose public schools are savages from the Bible Belt. I am sorry that you misunderstood me.

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