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Another anarchism thread.
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Absnt Offline
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Post: #1
Another anarchism thread.

Anarchism.

I like anarchism. Pretty much every form of government, weather it be democratic and free, or totalitarian, has immeasurable amounts of problems with it. Anarchism is great because it throws out the idea of government, and simply let's people live. The problem I have with that is that I doubt it could work.

I feel like people would take advantage of a lack of law enforcement and a lack of laws. They would form gangs, steal what they want, rape who they want, control who they want and basically become their own totalitarian government.

I've heard the arguments about forming a collective and protecting each other in a town or what have you, but I'm pretty sure that, in and of itself, is a small form of government. I'm pretty sure as the community grew, some greedy bastard would exploit it and take over. Increasing laws, increasing policing and basically form a government that lacks a constitution and human rights.

Anarchists are usually pretty intelligent, and I like a lot of them, but the way I figure it, anarchy wouldn't work.

Discuss.

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02-22-2011 01:37 PM
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HeartofShadows Offline
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Post: #2
Re: Another anarchism thread.

You pretty much hit the nail on the head with any belief, way of government or way of living.

Human nature will always ruin it somehow.

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02-22-2011 02:00 PM
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Prince Rilian Offline
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Post: #3
Re: Another anarchism thread.

Suppose anarchy did just lead back to some kind of government.

At least we'd have a few years of freedom.

Also, we have gangs and stuff now. And they exist in response to the biggest gang, the so-called "government".

The horror stories people come up with to argue against freedom are always stories of how it is now.

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02-22-2011 02:15 PM
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TehCheezGangsta Offline
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Post: #4
Re: Another anarchism thread.

No matter what, humans always end up ruining anything good. Damn humans.
02-22-2011 02:21 PM
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Prince Rilian Offline
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Post: #5
Re: Another anarchism thread.

TehCheezGangsta Wrote:No matter what, humans always end up ruining anything good. Damn humans.
Yeah, you suck.

Life is good. Jeta është e mirë. Goingcrazy
Die lewe is goed.
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02-22-2011 02:37 PM
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HeartofShadows Offline
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Post: #6
Re: Another anarchism thread.

I was a bit tired so I just sort of skimmed your post I'm afraid so I'll respond a little better.
Not an anarchist but hey.

Absentinsomniac Wrote:I feel like people would take advantage of a lack of law enforcement and a lack of laws. They would form gangs, steal what they want, rape who they want, control who they want and basically become their own totalitarian government.

Understand that nothing will be perfect but even without a government people will still form ways to protect themselves unless they are stupid and in which that case they'll die.
For the argument that people will kill each other through nature people will try to avoid things that can get them killed unless like above they are stupid and their doing the human race a favor.
Law enforcement nowadays works the same way as a gang to extort money from people in order to keep their jobs. No matter through society or anarchy gangs will always exist, they just call themselves different names.

Absentinsomniac Wrote:I've heard the arguments about forming a collective and protecting each other in a town or what have you, but I'm pretty sure that, in and of itself, is a small form of government. I'm pretty sure as the community grew, some greedy bastard would exploit it and take over. Increasing laws, increasing policing and basically form a government that lacks a constitution and human rights.

Just like capitalism always leads to corporatism Anarchy will always eventually lead to the birth of a society as communities go through that inevitable growth unless we go into a war economy in which case its a world of the strong destroying the weak. Human rights and freedoms are tools developed by society in order to help usher in a feeling of importance in a society when they most times easily break them(we can look at America as a fine example). Whether in a society or an anarchy human rights are just ideas in our head that don't really exist and we are just animals trying to survive in a now complicated food chain.

Absentinsomniac Wrote:Anarchists are usually pretty intelligent, and I like a lot of them, but the way I figure it, anarchy wouldn't work.

Lol no man.
I've met plenty of self proclaimed anarchists of different shapes and sizes and like and just like with any other ideas there are stupid ones, self righteous ones and zealots who believe they are heroes for taking on the big bad evil government.

Prince Rilian Wrote:The horror stories people come up with to argue against freedom are always stories of how it is now.

Seriously anything would work.
People just like clinging to what they think is best just like you.

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02-22-2011 10:32 PM
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Rebelnerd Offline
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Post: #7
Re: Another anarchism thread.

Look, you can't just say anarchy can't work because someone might take advantage of it. You can say that about literally any kind of society. All societies violate human nature in some way. What we need is enough people who believe in the societies ideals, who are politically aware enough to recognize an exploiter when he's still small and weak, and dedicated enough to take up arms in the ideology's defense.

I don't think that anarchy could work now. But that's not because anarchy itself is inherently doomed; it's because there simply aren't enough anarchists. I believe that that can change.

I think Buenaventura Durruti is a pretty cool guy. eh kills fascists and doesnt afraid of ruins.
The quickest way to kill a revolution is to wait for it.
02-23-2011 04:32 AM
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HeartofShadows Offline
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Post: #8
Re: Another anarchism thread.

Lol guys for fun look up Tokyo’s governor Shintaro Ishihara.

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02-23-2011 04:36 AM
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Absnt Offline
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Post: #9
Re: Another anarchism thread.

That's what I'm saying though... I can't think of a single system which would work, without an enormous amount of issues behind it. I think that after a certain amount of time, all systems will go to shit.

We've seen it happen in almost every nation that has ever been... From the beginning of human existence up until now... Everything has failed due to flaws.

I suppose if it were possible to keep everyone politically aware and in agreement, anarchy would be the best system, but is that possible? What if people decide they want to try out communism, capitalism or some other form of government? Forcing people to believe a certain way, or getting rid of people who don't believe in anarchy is kind of fucked up...

I think we should go take over some island somewhere that has enough natural resources for our purposes, and form an anarchist colony. That would probably work, at least for a while... I'd support it.

Quote:Lol guys for fun look up Tokyo’s governor Shintaro Ishihara.

lol.

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02-23-2011 07:14 AM
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HeartofShadows Offline
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Post: #10
Re: Another anarchism thread.

Absentinsomniac Wrote:We've seen it happen in almost every nation that has ever been... From the beginning of human existence up until now... Everything has failed due to flaws.

I suppose if it were possible to keep everyone politically aware and in agreement, anarchy would be the best system, but is that possible? What if people decide they want to try out communism, capitalism or some other form of government? Forcing people to believe a certain way, or getting rid of people who don't believe in anarchy is kind of fucked up...

To be honest the best system if people were to reach some form of enlightenment where they are willing to put away their selfish everything must be this way and establish a society for what its suppose to be then a modified equality would be the best.

Everybody doesn't have to agree on everything but the core rules of a society should be to make living better and equal for everyone.

People should have several ways of living and not just one like in our society.

hmm maybe I'm just being retarded here but I'm thinking what is this?

Then again Anarchy would be alright for anybody who could take care of themselves.
Anarchy is for the individual and as a whole it doesn't help the many.

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02-23-2011 07:50 AM
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Prince Rilian Offline
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Post: #11
Re: Another anarchism thread.

HeartofShadows Wrote:
Prince Rilian Wrote:The horror stories people come up with to argue against freedom are always stories of how it is now.

Seriously anything would work.
People just like clinging to what they think is best just like you.
What are you saying I'm clinging to?

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02-23-2011 08:31 AM
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Post: #12
Re: Another anarchism thread.

Prince Rilian Wrote:What are you saying I'm clinging to?

Excuse my wording.

People just have an idea that their idea is better.

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02-23-2011 11:20 AM
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Prince Rilian Offline
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Post: #13
Re: Another anarchism thread.

HeartofShadows Wrote:
Prince Rilian Wrote:What are you saying I'm clinging to?

Excuse my wording.

People just have an idea that their idea is better.
My "idea" is just respecting people's property, including their body.

Is that really so controversial?

Life is good. Jeta është e mirë. Goingcrazy
Die lewe is goed.
Het leven is goed.

Zoidberg: What is it, already? What's the cause of your anger?
Leela: I guess I would have to say, I hate you!
02-23-2011 12:47 PM
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HeartofShadows Offline
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Post: #14
Re: Another anarchism thread.

Prince Rilian Wrote:
HeartofShadows Wrote:
Prince Rilian Wrote:What are you saying I'm clinging to?

Excuse my wording.

People just have an idea that their idea is better.
My "idea" is just respecting people's property, including their body.

Is that really so controversial?

Calm down I'm not saying your belief is controversial.
I'm just saying that everybody comes out with this my idea is better best enlightened nonsense.
We all do it so no need to get all upset.

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02-23-2011 12:58 PM
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Prince Rilian Offline
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Post: #15
Re: Another anarchism thread.

HeartofShadows Wrote:
Prince Rilian Wrote:
HeartofShadows Wrote:Excuse my wording.

People just have an idea that their idea is better.
My "idea" is just respecting people's property, including their body.

Is that really so controversial?

Calm down I'm not saying your belief is controversial.
I'm just saying that everybody comes out with this my idea is better best enlightened nonsense.
We all do it so no need to get all upset.
The only alternative to freedom is slavery. Freedom is definitely "better". By definition. Not because it "works" but because. It is. Freedom is right, slavery is wrong. What "works" for whoever is irrelevant.

Life is good. Jeta është e mirë. Goingcrazy
Die lewe is goed.
Het leven is goed.

Zoidberg: What is it, already? What's the cause of your anger?
Leela: I guess I would have to say, I hate you!
02-23-2011 01:44 PM
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HeartofShadows Offline
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Re: Another anarchism thread.

Prince Rilian Wrote:The only alternative to freedom is slavery. Freedom is definitely "better". By definition. Not because it "works" but because. It is. Freedom is right, slavery is wrong. What "works" for whoever is irrelevant.

See now that's where you and I differ.
You use terms like right and wrong to justify what you do like some kind of moral crutch.
I actually prefer freedom myself than to living under someone's thumb but I don't justify actions with moral compasses that were made by society anyway.

Then again I know how you are and you'll just get pissed at me and insult me so lets just agree to disagree then shall we. Smile

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02-23-2011 02:37 PM
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Prince Rilian Offline
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Post: #17
Re: Another anarchism thread.

HeartofShadows Wrote:
Prince Rilian Wrote:The only alternative to freedom is slavery. Freedom is definitely "better". By definition. Not because it "works" but because. It is. Freedom is right, slavery is wrong. What "works" for whoever is irrelevant.

See now that's where you and I differ.
You use terms like right and wrong to justify what you do like some kind of moral crutch.
I actually prefer freedom myself than to living under someone's thumb but I don't justify actions with moral compasses that were made by society anyway.

Then again I know how you are and you'll just get pissed at me and insult me so lets just agree to disagree then shall we. Smile
You prefer it for yourself, and that's the reason to give it to others. All others. It has nothing to do with being brainwashed by society or whatever.

Life is good. Jeta është e mirë. Goingcrazy
Die lewe is goed.
Het leven is goed.

Zoidberg: What is it, already? What's the cause of your anger?
Leela: I guess I would have to say, I hate you!
02-23-2011 02:51 PM
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Post: #18
Re: Another anarchism thread.

Prince Rilian Wrote:You prefer it for yourself, and that's the reason to give it to others. All others. It has nothing to do with being brainwashed by society or whatever.

Wow that's really preachy Rillian.
Really starting to remind me of Rebelnerd in a small way. Laugh but I'll ask.
What about those who don't want freedom?
What about those who are too afraid and want to be taken care of by some higher authority?

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Prince Rilian Offline
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Post: #19
Re: Another anarchism thread.

HeartofShadows Wrote:
Prince Rilian Wrote:You prefer it for yourself, and that's the reason to give it to others. All others. It has nothing to do with being brainwashed by society or whatever.

Wow that's really preachy Rillian.
?
Quote:Really starting to remind me of Rebelnerd in a small way. Laugh but I'll ask.
What about those who don't want freedom?
What about those who are too afraid and want to be taken care of by some higher authority?
They have the freedom to choose that. OF COURSE. You're either trolling or stupid.

Life is good. Jeta është e mirë. Goingcrazy
Die lewe is goed.
Het leven is goed.

Zoidberg: What is it, already? What's the cause of your anger?
Leela: I guess I would have to say, I hate you!
02-23-2011 03:04 PM
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The Desert Fox Offline
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Post: #20
Re: Another anarchism thread.

Christ, Rilian, you have a short fuse.

Hidden stuff:
(11-27-2011 01:00 PM)psychopath Wrote:  
(11-27-2011 10:52 AM)Efs Wrote:  Our Army is more professional than Amerika. Smile
Except ours isn't allowed to have guns
CrayolaColours Wrote:That post owned. TDF wins post of the year.
Faby Wrote:
krissy Wrote:dessert fox
Mmm, flambéed vulpine.
"There is no enemy, there is no victory, only boys who lost their lives in the sand."
[/center]
02-23-2011 03:19 PM
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Post: #21
Re: Another anarchism thread.

Prince Rilian Wrote:
HeartofShadows Wrote:
Prince Rilian Wrote:You prefer it for yourself, and that's the reason to give it to others. All others. It has nothing to do with being brainwashed by society or whatever.

Wow that's really preachy Rillian.
?
Quote:Really starting to remind me of Rebelnerd in a small way. Laugh but I'll ask.
What about those who don't want freedom?
What about those who are too afraid and want to be taken care of by some higher authority?
They have the freedom to choose that. OF COURSE. You're either trolling or stupid.

I just ment its really inspiring Rillian. Laugh

Now for the last one and no need to insult me Rillian I'm just doing a creative sort of analysis and am not trolling you, I just try to have a open mind when I try to examine ideas.
People are hypocrites, and some don't want freedom as that actually takes effort to maintain and actually live up too.
Some want a government to make decisions for them on how to live and etc(you're a smart guy so you know where I'm going).

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02-23-2011 03:20 PM
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Post: #22
Re: Another anarchism thread.

The Desert Fox Wrote:Christ, Rilian, you have a short fuse.

Something I said earlier..

HeartofShadows Wrote:Lol no man.
I've met plenty of self proclaimed anarchists of different shapes and sizes and the like and just like with any other ideas there are stupid ones, self righteous ones and zealots who believe they are heroes for taking on the big bad evil government.

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02-23-2011 03:24 PM
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Prince Rilian Offline
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Post: #23
Re: Another anarchism thread.

The Desert Fox Wrote:Christ, Rilian, you have a short fuse.
I have little patience for idiocy.

Life is good. Jeta është e mirë. Goingcrazy
Die lewe is goed.
Het leven is goed.

Zoidberg: What is it, already? What's the cause of your anger?
Leela: I guess I would have to say, I hate you!
02-23-2011 03:31 PM
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Post: #24
Re: Another anarchism thread.

Prince Rilian Wrote:
The Desert Fox Wrote:Christ, Rilian, you have a short fuse.
I have little patience for anything.
Fix'd

Hidden stuff:
(11-27-2011 01:00 PM)psychopath Wrote:  
(11-27-2011 10:52 AM)Efs Wrote:  Our Army is more professional than Amerika. Smile
Except ours isn't allowed to have guns
CrayolaColours Wrote:That post owned. TDF wins post of the year.
Faby Wrote:
krissy Wrote:dessert fox
Mmm, flambéed vulpine.
"There is no enemy, there is no victory, only boys who lost their lives in the sand."
[/center]
02-23-2011 03:31 PM
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Post: #25
Re: Another anarchism thread.

The Desert Fox Wrote:
Prince Rilian Wrote:
The Desert Fox Wrote:Christ, Rilian, you have a short fuse.
I have little patience for anything that questions anarchy.
Fix'd

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02-23-2011 03:33 PM
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Post: #26
Re: Another anarchism thread.

The Desert Fox Wrote:
Prince Rilian Wrote:
The Desert Fox Wrote:Christ, Rilian, you have a short fuse.
I have little patience for idiocy.
Fix'd
I fixed your idiocy for you.
Any time you've seen me appear "impatient" or whatever, it's been in response to idiocy. So your claim is based on nothing.

Life is good. Jeta është e mirë. Goingcrazy
Die lewe is goed.
Het leven is goed.

Zoidberg: What is it, already? What's the cause of your anger?
Leela: I guess I would have to say, I hate you!
02-23-2011 03:35 PM
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Post: #27
Re: Another anarchism thread.

So HoS looking at the argument from one of several different points is idiocy?

Hidden stuff:
(11-27-2011 01:00 PM)psychopath Wrote:  
(11-27-2011 10:52 AM)Efs Wrote:  Our Army is more professional than Amerika. Smile
Except ours isn't allowed to have guns
CrayolaColours Wrote:That post owned. TDF wins post of the year.
Faby Wrote:
krissy Wrote:dessert fox
Mmm, flambéed vulpine.
"There is no enemy, there is no victory, only boys who lost their lives in the sand."
[/center]
02-23-2011 03:37 PM
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Post: #28
Re: Another anarchism thread.

The Desert Fox Wrote:So HoS looking at the argument from one of several different points is idiocy?
I say I want people to be free and then she implies that I would enslave them somehow. That's totally fucking utterly stupid. It's insoportable.

Life is good. Jeta është e mirë. Goingcrazy
Die lewe is goed.
Het leven is goed.

Zoidberg: What is it, already? What's the cause of your anger?
Leela: I guess I would have to say, I hate you!
02-23-2011 03:40 PM
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Post: #29
Re: Another anarchism thread.

Prince Rilian Wrote:
The Desert Fox Wrote:So HoS looking at the argument from one of several different points is idiocy?
I say I want people to be free and then she implies that I would enslave them somehow. That's totally fucking utterly stupid. It's insoportable.

Dear lord your highness you have misunderstood me.

you say that people all generally want to be free and freedom is right and the alternate is slavery when I said that some people generally don't want freedom as it requires responsibility and Independence and they would rather be taken care of and suddenly its idiocy.

I think there was some sort of miscommunication somewhere Prince.

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Re: Another anarchism thread.

Prince Rilian Wrote:
HeartofShadows Wrote:What about those who don't want freedom?
What about those who are too afraid and want to be taken care of by some higher authority?
They have the freedom to choose that. OF COURSE. You're either trolling or stupid.
I disagree. Their high probability of collaboration with potential tyrants puts the entire population at risk by giving ambitious individuals a source of labor unavailable to the anarchists. These people will just have to learn to live with freedom for the greater good, and if they begin to accumulate around a charismatic individual, then they're fair game once the free people decide that their leader is becoming a threat.

I apologize in advance for invoking Godwin's Law, but did the German people have the right to choose to fight for Hitler, a man who would stop at nothing short of world domination? Of course not, and we were right to invade them for it. Because respecting their right to make that one choice meant jeopardizing the right of literally every other human being on Earth to make any choices. Remember, a tyrant is only as dangerous as the crowd who follows him. Without the sheep he's just an angry idiot.

I think Buenaventura Durruti is a pretty cool guy. eh kills fascists and doesnt afraid of ruins.
The quickest way to kill a revolution is to wait for it.
02-23-2011 03:52 PM
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