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August 2001 - June 2017
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To everyone who joined these forums at some point, and got discouraged by the negativity and left after a while (or even got literally scared off): I'm sorry.
I wasn't good enough at encouraging people to be kinder, and removing people who refuse to be kind. Encouraging people is hard, and removing people creates conflict, and I hate conflict... so that's why I wasn't better at it.
I was a very, very sensitive teen. The atmosphere of this forum as it is now, if it had existed in 1996, would probably have upset me far more than it would have helped.
I can handle quite a lot of negativity and even abuse now, but that isn't the point. I want to help people. I want to help the people who need it the most, and I want to help people like the 1996 version of me.
I'm still figuring out the best way to do that, but as it is now, these forums are doing more harm than good, and I can't keep running them.
Thank you to the few people who have tried to understand my point of view so far. I really, really appreciate you guys. You are beautiful people.
Everyone else: If after everything I've said so far, you still don't understand my motivations, I think it's unlikely that you will. We're just too different. Maybe someday in the future it might make sense, but until then, there's no point in arguing about it. I don't have the time or the energy for arguing anymore. I will focus my time and energy on people who support me, and those who need help.
-SoulRiser
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Is there anything that people do that isn't motivated in some way by the desire for self-glorification? Even when people do good deeds for others, they do it because it gives them some sense of self satisfaction or joy, or at least the feeling that they did the right thing. It makes everything in life seem so vain, how everything that people do is just a way to serve themselves.
Haley brings up an EXTREAMLY interesting thought. She even touched upon the idea that by ding good things it is in the intrest of making yourself feel good. Doing somthing because you have to also fails because you are doing it becasue if you dont people will get on your case, so you do it to kep people from bitching about shit. This is a HARD topic. I shall sleep on this tonight. My hat is off to such a thought inspiring topic.
Whilst some work diligently there are those who ask why. I am one of them
(\__/) This is Bunny. Paste Bunny into your signature
(='.'=) to help him gain world domination.
(")_(")
Soul#2: I already have a grip. Doc:and a porno mag and a tube of lube I'm sure"
Lifes a bitch, then you marry one
This has been a test of the emergency pointless argument system. Had this been a real pointless argument, someone would have been called a facist.
Ceiling Cat: For that you need to wear a fursuit, though.
Inside sources say that Carla Franklin has had more dick in her than a public urinal.
I don't think that the idea of greed necessarily extends towards people who would otherwise be considered beneficiaries. Think about the kinds of people that we normally associate with greed, then compare them with wealthy people who otherwise lack the connotation. Warren Buffet, though insanely rich, is seen by many as generous for his donations. Scrooge, though a fictional character, lies on the opposite end. Though rich as well, he never gives a cent to charity, refuses to give his employees Christmas off, and pays them a disparagingly small amount of money for their services, thus synonymizing his own name with greed. I think the act of greed isn't merely one's self service, but said self service when it comes as a detriment to others.
Formerly Headspace
04-22-2008 10:52 AM
Thanks given by:
SoulRiser
Site Founder
Posts: 18,238
Joined: Aug 2001
If doing the right thing felt terrible and guaranteed you a life of misery, would you still do it?
(I'm still thinking about that one)
It's actually hard to imagine how doing the right thing could possibly NOT feel good. But do you really do it because it feels good, or because it's the right thing to do, and the good feeling is just a convenient side effect? I guess that goes back to my first question. Which I'm still thinking about.
Support School Survival on Patreon or Donate Bitcoin Here: 1Q5WCcxWjayniaL92b8GfXBiGdfjmnUNa2 "Believe those who are seeking the truth. Doubt those who find it." - André Paul Guillaume Gide "The true sign of intelligence is not knowledge but imagination." - Albert Einstein "I'm pretty sure there's a lot of beauty that can only be found in the mind of a lunatic." - TheCancer EIPD - Emotionally Incompetent Parent Disorder
Basically it said that selfishness is inescapable, but that there are different kinds of selfishness. An act of kindness, while selfish, is still an act of kindness. You're helping more people than just yourself. Stealing for personal gain is selfish, but you're only helping yourself in this case, which makes it bad.
I don't know if I made that readable enough... Do I make sense?
And sometimes I think this isn't the case. Sometimes, I am in the same situation as before, and the 'right thing to do' becomes tedious, and I hate doing it. So I don't think it's ALL cases, just most.
I highly suggest Mobb Deep's albums The Infamous and Hell on Earth, if you have not listened to it yet.
It's actually hard to imagine how doing the right thing could possibly NOT feel good. quote] people live it everyday, Mugabes apposers are doing the right thing as it may feel good when they stand up but does it still feel good when they are being persecuted?
Not all good acts are selfish. The man at Glasgow airport didn't think oh I'll feel good ifs I knock that man unconcious he thought I should stop that man he is going to hurt people.
And if doing the wrong thing can feel good to some people then doing the right thing can sometimes feel bad like if someone (little kids example) bullies you and picks on you so you don';t invite them to your house that is the right thing in a sense but you might still feel bad.
butterfly kisses xxx
COMMUNISM is when you have two cows, the governement takes both and gives you the milk SOCIALISM is when you have two cows and give one to your neighbour. NEW DEALISM (is when things go wrong) is when you have two cows, the government takes both, shoots one and milks the other but then throws the milk away. CAPITALISM is when you have two cows and then sell one to buy a bull. FACISM is when you have two cows, the government takes both and sells you the milk. NAZISM is when you have two cows, the government takes both and shoots you.
I typed: "end of the world" into google and saw the hiroshima bombing and 9/11, irony much.
Eidolon Wrote:I read an article once about this once.
Basically it said that selfishness is inescapable, but that there are different kinds of selfishness. An act of kindness, while selfish, is still an act of kindness. You're helping more people than just yourself. Stealing for personal gain is selfish, but you're only helping yourself in this case, which makes it bad.
I don't know if I made that readable enough... Do I make sense?
I really like your take on this. I guess people need some sort of motivation to help each other out, and even if it's based off selfishness, it can't be entirely selfish if it's helping someone else out in the process.
Yeah, the original Cynics believed people never did anything for any reason unless it was for them in some way. I dunno about that, really. Giving up your life to save some random person on the street sounds pretty selfless. Though it might also be stupidity.
K
S
04-23-2008 08:41 AM
Thanks given by:
SoulRiser
Site Founder
Posts: 18,238
Joined: Aug 2001
Yeah, how does it feel good to give up your life for someone else? There's no guarantee you'll even feel anything at all when you're dead. Maybe it feels good in the split second before you die, though. But is a split second of nice feeling worth dying for? I think there must be more to it when people do things like that.
Even if doing something feels good afterwards, that still doesn't mean it's the reason you do it.
Support School Survival on Patreon or Donate Bitcoin Here: 1Q5WCcxWjayniaL92b8GfXBiGdfjmnUNa2 "Believe those who are seeking the truth. Doubt those who find it." - André Paul Guillaume Gide "The true sign of intelligence is not knowledge but imagination." - Albert Einstein "I'm pretty sure there's a lot of beauty that can only be found in the mind of a lunatic." - TheCancer EIPD - Emotionally Incompetent Parent Disorder
Think illnesses for this one. My mom is something of a down syndrome activist because my sister has down syndrome. Down syndrome kids did exist before my sister was born, it's just my Mom has a selfish desire to feel like she has some sense of value by going to meetings, activism, etc. It's all really materialism, but by the same count it is OK because we do, with all the machines flaws, have some benefit from the concept of private charity as a means to fufill materialist desires. The fact most people look to their bottom line goal as opposed to the road towards that goal allow it to be a continuous cycle. Feel guilty? Donate again.
"If you think you know what the hell is going on, you're probably full of shit." - Robert Anton Wilson
you are wired to be selfish. for instance, you eat because it gives off dopamine in the brain, which makes us happy. our survival is based on what makes us happy. people that are generous give money because they get a warm fuzzy feeling from it. so stop trying to say selfishness is a bad thing, if you think about it, it's that selfishness that makes that rich guy give his money. :mindfuck:
11-20-2011 08:45 AM
Thanks given by:
SH☮TGUNHEⒶRT
Hi, I 'm anti-civ.
Posts: 775
Joined: Mar 2011
"Everybody has a sense of self-interest, and the capability to act in a selfish way at other people’s expense. But everyone also has a sense of the needs of those around them, and we are all capable of generous and selfless actions. Human survival depends on generosity."- Peter Gelderloos
I'm sorry It's impossible to function reasonable completely off of selfishness, because you need everyone else to get those needs met.
Live is about pursuing your interests and staying true to yourself, but seriously if you think you can live simply in the motives to serve yourself then you are tripping. You're always going to have to have someone else helping you fulfill those needs. It's the basics of human survival.
To be an anarchist, is to suffer greatly. To be a black woman is to suffer secretly. To be the earth, is to suffer silently.
I wish no harm on anyone, but those whose harmful ways will not stop without the same harm.
It's time we kill this cancerous system, before it kills us and everything left of gaia. Rise from our immaturity and take back our autonomy!
We all need to be some selfish because even if we are helping others we are doing that for heaven form God.We need heaven and we don't want hell
that's the point.
12-14-2011 02:47 PM
Thanks given by:
thewake
Unconstructive
Posts: 5,917
Joined: Jun 2007
(04-22-2008 09:21 AM)Hayley44 Wrote: Is there anything that people do that isn't motivated in some way by the desire for self-glorification? Even when people do good deeds for others, they do it because it gives them some sense of self satisfaction or joy, or at least the feeling that they did the right thing. It makes everything in life seem so vain, how everything that people do is just a way to serve themselves.
There are many people in the world that I would die for, but there's always the people in the world where I would pay to see them tortured and killed.
-Me
The Twisted Smiley Belongs To Twisted
"Treat every problem as a challenge, not a dead end. And treat every question like an obstacle worthy of your effort." -my friend's wise Asian father (Sounds better in Chinese)
OBNOXIOUSLY HUGE AND NOTICEABLE
01-13-2013 12:48 PM
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brainiac3397
Machiavellian Amoeba
Posts: 9,823
Joined: Feb 2013
Concerned excessively or exclusively with oneself : seeking or concentrating on one's own advantage, pleasure, or well-being without regard for others.
Although you can feel good by putting people before you, it is all about for the sake of loving true goodness and rejecting evil, you can sacrifice even if it is painful, even if the putting of them before you may leave you weak, being selfless for the sake of selflessness, and not for pleasure, is true virtue. There is a difference between pleasure and happiness. Pleasure is primarily selfish, it seeks good feelings from using people, things etc. Happiness is more about internal goodness. Happiness is more of an attitude or condition, while pleasure is a short-lived emotion. Pleasure is about the senses, happiness is about the heart/soul. However, since we are imperfect and incomplete beings, we can't transcend our selfishness completely.
Though remember, selfishness should not be confused with self love.
(This post was last modified: 07-02-2015 05:33 PM by Cianna200.)
07-02-2015 05:14 PM
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thewake
Unconstructive
Posts: 5,917
Joined: Jun 2007