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liq3 · 08-27-2008 08:35 AM

Rebel. I keep reading all over the forums "but they'd give me a detention" and stuff like that. Unless you have abusive parents, the worst thing to fear is probably boot camp. If you know you're parents won't send you there, why not just rebel? I'm not saying leave school...Just don't go to detentions, if they suspend you just stay home. Do work you WANT to do in class. Ignore teachers orders. If they call your parents, so what?

Now, following this advice will likely lead to you falling behind on most classes, probably failing them. Will also likely lead to expulsion. Is that a bad thing? Maybe...thing is, get expelled enough, and I doubt any school will take you after a while. Guess what, now you're parents HAVE to home school you.

I can see so many ways rebelling could be useful...It will draw HEAPS of attention to the 'problem'. After a month or two of this, it should be much easier to convince your parents to let you homeschool (unless they are neocons), especially if you were doing your own projects at the same time. Other ways is that if you don't fear failing or expulsion, they won't be able to make you do ANYTHING. The schools control you through terrorism. They only have power over you because you LET them.

Seriously, this forum is turning into a "omg i'm so sad and whiny because I'm scared of X happening". It's getting annoying. Stop whining, and do something. Stand out of the crowd, rebel, and at the very least you might inspire someone else to do it too. How awesome would that be? A chain reaction of rebelling.

KitsuneSefam · 08-27-2008 08:52 AM

liq3 Wrote:Unless you have abusive parents

I prefer going to a detention than being screamed at and hit(Yes, it is that bad).

But if i get a detention for something such as self-defense, believe me, i won't go.

I simply adapt to survive, i will stand out of the crowd if i see it being beneficial to me and not the opposite.

**SoulRiser** · 08-27-2008 08:59 AM

Yeah, I wouldn't do that either if I was KitsuneSefam Razz

But I'm sure a lot of people could do it. I probably could have. I only tried it for one day and it failed miserably (for that day - they still made me go and I was too scared to try it again), though it did draw attention to the problem and I got to go to a private school the next year (no more bullies, yay)...

KitsuneSefam · 08-27-2008 09:04 AM

SoulRiser Wrote:Yeah, I wouldn't do that either if I was KitsuneSefam

But I'm sure a lot of people could do it. I probably could have. I only tried it for one day and it failed miserably (for that day - they still made me go and I was too scared to try it again), though it did draw attention to the problem and I got to go to a private school the next year (no more bullies, yay)...

And i only have this year left, i can't afford to screw up now =/, i'd better finish this than let my 11 other years go more to waste than they already were.

Happy Camper · 08-27-2008 09:09 AM

It's called picking your battles. Civil Disobedience.

Darthmat · 08-27-2008 09:12 AM

Happy Camper Wrote:It's called picking your battles. Civil Disobedience.

Fire Elf · 08-27-2008 09:58 AM

True, if a detention is really such a bad thing don't go to it. The worst they can do is give you an all-expenses-paid vacation (which isn't even really a punishment unless your parents are the "OMG the school suspended you you are a terrible person (delusional ranting)" types. Hell, all my school ever did was give an extra detention for every time it's not served. And, well, since one could skip the second one as well, there's not much that they could do.

liq3 · 08-27-2008 10:15 AM

Happy Camper Wrote:It's called picking your battles. Civil Disobedience.

Then how about they stop whining? It's bloody stupid (and annoying) when someone whines about something, but does nothing to change it.

KitsuneSefam · 08-27-2008 10:23 AM

liq3 Wrote:
Happy Camper Wrote:It's called picking your battles. Civil Disobedience.
Then how about they stop whining? It's bloody stupid (and annoying) when someone whines about something, but does nothing to change it.

First, it's not whining, it's complaints.

Second, i complain because i CANNOT do anything about it, my parents won't listen to me and just scream at me and all the people i know IRL are totally brainwashed and will keep telling me blatant bullshit about school. And because it feels good to vent sometimes.

liq3 · 08-27-2008 10:37 AM

KitsuneSefam Wrote:First, it's not whining, it's complaints.

Second, i complain because i CANNOT do anything about it, my parents won't listen to me and just scream at me and all the people i know IRL are totally brainwashed and will keep telling me blatant bullshit about school. And because it feels good to vent sometimes.

Arg. This is why I hate people whining. The thing that keeps coming to mind is the father that comes home everyday and complains about his job for 30 years.

The forums are making feel like I'm married to that guy.

"omg, I have this horrible teacher who is SO annoying. She insults me and gets away it! and i'm sure she is giving me lower grades because she doesn't like me!!!!"

I see stuff like that all the forums. I never see anything like.

"I have this teacher who is treating me unfairly. Tomorrow I'm going to speak to the administration about it".

But then, even those people end up whining...

"They just dismissed me, ignored me, so now I'm going to hang around here for a while and once every two weeks complain about school. I won't do anything about it though. Nah, I'll just complain".

Look, I'm mainly ticked off that basically no one is doing anything, AND they are whining.

KitsuneSefam · 08-27-2008 11:12 AM

liq3 Wrote:"omg, I have this horrible teacher who is SO annoying. She insults me and gets away it! and i'm sure she is giving me lower grades because she doesn't like me!!!!"

"I have this teacher who is treating me unfairly. Tomorrow I'm going to speak to the administration about it".

But then, even those people end up whining...

"They just dismissed me, ignored me, so now I'm going to hang around here for a while and once every two weeks complain about school. I won't do anything about it though. Nah, I'll just complain".

If that would end up happening, i would complain about it for a while, and raising a petition won't do anything, they won't care about students but those fuckers are still gonna hear me complaining in their office if more happens.

And i always complaint because i am stuck in school and can do nothing about it, you are telling me i should plainly shut up? Yes, i try to convince people that our cause is good often, but i still can't do anything about school.

liq3 · 08-27-2008 11:26 AM

KitsuneSefam Wrote:you are telling me i should plainly shut up?

No, just stop whining. o.O

Darthmat · 08-27-2008 11:32 AM

* Darthmat sighs

liq3 Wrote:Arg. This is why I hate people whining.

You seem to be doing a lot of winging Mr. iHatewhining.

Quote: The thing that keeps coming to mind is the father that comes home everyday and complains about his job for 30 years.The forums are making feel like I'm married to that guy.

So leave?

Quote:"omg, I have this horrible teacher who is SO annoying. She insults me and gets away it! and i'm sure she is giving me lower grades because she doesn't like me!!!!"

Some people feel stressed by this... and are stressed by different things then you.

Quote:"I have this teacher who is treating me unfairly. Tomorrow I'm going to speak to the administration about it".

Not everyone is mature or rational enough in times of pressure to think about it that way. And sometimes the admin won't or can't helpp.

Quote:But then, even those people end up whining...

So nothing is good enough for you. And... none of us care.

Quote:Look, I'm mainly ticked off that basically no one is doing anything, AND they are whining.

Wrong. People are doing things. Small things, but things. An example is United Students.

Ahab · 08-27-2008 11:40 AM

Stop being a little bitch liq3. You're on a forum full of depressed kids. Most of them aren't going to grow balls and face up to their problem (let alone quit school) any time soon. The best you can do is egg them on and provide testimonials, ways they can quit easier/convince their parents easier, and so on. Positive consistency is much better than being the coach at gym class.

KitsuneSefam · 08-27-2008 11:45 AM

Ahab Wrote:Stop being a little bitch liq3. You're on a forum full of depressed kids. Most of them aren't going to grow balls and face up to their problem (let alone quit school) any time soon. The best you can do is egg them on and provide testimonials, ways they can quit easier/convince their parents easier, and so on. Positive consistency is much better than being the coach at gym class.

Most of us can't face up to their problems too much.

I try in every way that won't put in a hole of shit.

magikarp · 08-27-2008 11:57 AM

Not everyone has a ~~philosophy~~ religion that makes them feel like they have control over things that they probably don't.

Just because you can refuse to go to school doesn't mean you necessarily should. Depending on how your parents would react, it could actually be better to stay in school and at least pass. But just because it's better doesn't mean it's good. If I have several options, none of which are desirable, can't I complain then? (There may be other options which I haven't considered, but I can't be reasonably expected to do something if I haven't even thought of it.)

I can control my actions, but I don't solely control the consequences of them--other people who are involved sometimes act in ways which are difficult to predict. Also, like I said before, sometimes there will be a situation in which there's no "good" solution. I do agree that fear shouldn't be involved much in decision-making, though. It just takes a while for most people to be able to make decisions without being unduly influenced by others or by irrational fear.

dreamer... · 08-27-2008 12:20 PM

As for why not...

1. Fear is a very powerful motivator. You're probably among the more fearless, but remember that not everyone is like you.

2. It's a lot easier to whine and play the victim than it is to stand up for yourself and be assertive. Submission lets you do nothing and simply endure school, which is accepted behavior. Assertion involves taking risks...some people aren't ready for that.

3. Once you're known as the submissive type, changing your ways is extra risky. You're defying the reputation you've built up, leaving you vulnerable.

Instead of whining about the whining, can't you suggest some ways to overcome the fear that keeps us from rebelling?

liq3 · 08-27-2008 12:28 PM

dreamer... Wrote:Instead of whining about the whining, can't you suggest some ways to overcome the fear that keeps us from rebelling?

http://www.stevepavlina.com/articles/co ... iously.htm

Note to all SR bashers: Steve Pavlina has heaps of great advice that is unrelated to SR. About 1-3% of his articles are actually SR related. Thought I'd make it clear.

Also, that's my point...No one even ASKS "how do I overcome fear?". I had the impression that no one was doing anything. Now I think it's more of everyone wants to do something, but don't know how or don't have the guts for it. Hrm.

http://www.stevepavlina.com/blog/2008/0 ... y-problem/

P.S. I've been on this site for about 1 and a half years. I've seen little done. I still love this site, but it's about time people started doing stuff. The forums seem to be all "we'll make every feel good, but not actually help them get anything done". The latter part needs to change.

dreamer... · 08-27-2008 02:18 PM

That first article was very inspiring. Thanks for the link Smile

The last paragraph in particular caught my attention:

Steve Pavlina Wrote:Don't die without embracing the daring adventure your life is meant to be. You may go broke. You may experience failure and rejection repeatedly. You may endure multiple dysfunctional relationships. But these are all milestones along the path of a life lived courageously. They are your private victories, carving a deeper space within you to be filled with an abundance of joy, happiness, and fulfillment. So go ahead and feel the fear - then summon the courage to follow your dreams anyway. That is strength undefeatable.

This is all so true...of course you're going to mess up sometimes. Of course you'll fail once in a while. You're also bound to succeed sometimes, too. I remember back at 4th grade graduation, we had to give short speeches in front of our parents, and I recall saying "mistakes are just lessons that tell you 'don't try that again.'" Yet for the rest of my time at school, I was terrified of making mistakes, unquestioningly obedient to my teachers. Too bad. I should have taken my own advice. People would be so much happier if they threw caution to the winds for once, learned from their mistakes, and embraced their dreams.

That article really gives me a lot to think about. Maybe I can survive without going to college, as everyone else expects me to. Maybe if people stepped outside the proverbial box, they would realize it isn't as horrid as they say.

liq3 Wrote:Now I think it's more of everyone wants to do something, but don't know how or don't have the guts for it.

This is definitely the case. The people that are actually doing something ought to show the rest of us how we can do something, and how we can find the guts to do it.

Happy Camper · 08-27-2008 03:28 PM

liq3 Wrote:
Happy Camper Wrote:It's called picking your battles. Civil Disobedience.
Then how about they stop whining? It's bloody stupid (and annoying) when someone whines about something, but does nothing to change it.

Most of the whining can get rather annoying.

But there's also the need to rant from time to time. Like, "I hate my boss because...!" I don't really hate my boss, but he does have qualities that bug me. And sometimes if I talk about how much it sucks, I feel a little better.

Now it's true, when this is done in excess, you're just going to annoy people. They're going to stop listening to you. Then when a valid complaint comes along, it'll be the boy who cried, "My life sucks!"

**SoulRiser** · 08-28-2008 12:41 AM

Good to see this thread has moved past the whining about whiners and has gotten interesting. Thumbsup

liq3, I don't know if you've seen this post, but that probably explains why not everyone is ready to just "do something". They may be ready later. The most anyone can really do is just keep encouraging them... without nagging.

liq3 · 08-28-2008 03:42 AM

SoulRiser Wrote:Good to see this thread has moved past the whining about whiners and has gotten interesting.

liq3, I don't know if you've seen this post, but that probably explains why not everyone is ready to just "do something". They may be ready later. The most anyone can really do is just keep encouraging them... without nagging.

Hrm...that makes more sense.

I think I shall start mass posting links to Steve's articles. :]

Darthmat · 08-28-2008 05:36 AM

liq3 Wrote:I think I shall start mass posting links to Steve's articles. :]

Does not compute.

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