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Arguing anti-school positions
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magikarp Offline
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Post: #1
Arguing anti-school positions

I think that often we think our ideas are so obvious that they aren't worth explaining, and that may make others believe that we have no justification for them. Even when it doesn't matter if other people agree, coming up with a valid argument can help to ensure your beliefs are consistent and justified. (Personally, I also think having more arguments that don't degrade into name-calling would benefit the forums regardless of whether any minds are changed.)

Anyway, here are some suggestions for having srs discussions, if that's what you want to do:
  • Don't assume everyone who disagrees with you is a troll. This can just be a way of getting out of an argument easily (or avoiding thinking that you may be wrong), and if they are a troll, they'll likely lose interest when you don't get angry. The sincerity of the poster isn't as important as the quality of their argument, although I understand it gets tiring after a while if you suspect someone is just being disagreeable.[/*]
  • Keep the subject of discussion in mind. It's unnecessary and distracting to argue about small details of posts, except when those details are important to the main point being argued.[/*]
  • Remember why you're arguing. Sometimes it's easy to get caught up in an argument and say anything to 'win', but that's counter-productive if you were originally only trying to justify your point of view.[/*]
  • Try to avoid writing about ideas that you couldn't explain if asked to. This seems to happen a lot here, probably because the fact that nearly every agrees with each other makes it easy to just repeat something that's been said before. It's perfectly fine to get ideas from other people, but if you can't justify those ideas, it makes your argument weak and doesn't contribute a lot.[/*]
    [/list:u]

    Post your own suggestions (or disagreements), if you'd like.

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01-22-2009 10:29 AM
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SoulRiser Offline
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Post: #2
Re: Arguing anti-school positions

This is win. I made it an announcement.

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01-24-2009 05:32 AM
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Darthmat Offline
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Post: #3
Re: Arguing anti-school positions

Don't enforce the steryoptype. Act maturely.

I highly suggest Mobb Deep's albums The Infamous and Hell on Earth, if you have not listened to it yet.
01-24-2009 06:45 AM
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Albatross Offline
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Post: #4
Re: Arguing anti-school positions

Don't be dyke, a paradox or a Jew...
01-24-2009 10:27 AM
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Faby Offline
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Post: #5
Re: Arguing anti-school positions

Arguing is nice and all, but in the end it all comes down to being pro-school and anti-school, and it's not like anyone's ever going to change our views, even if they are well-argued. We might bring tonnes of arguments as to why school is bad, but we don't feel it's bad because of the arguments we bring, but because of the feelings that derive from going to school.

I'm not saying discussing things is bad, but when two contrasting sides argue, you won't convince either one to see things the way the other does.

Let go of all desire for the common good, and the good becomes common as grass.

~~

Good fortune follows upon disaster;
Disaster lurks within good fortune;
Who can say how things will end?
Perhaps there is no end.
01-24-2009 05:43 PM
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Apathy Offline
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Post: #6
Re: Arguing anti-school positions

Thanks fist, this is exactly the sort of thinking that will fix SS.

It's pathetic that this needed to be explained though. It's basic thinking that should be utilised in everyday life.
01-25-2009 11:31 PM
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Albatross Offline
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Post: #7
Re: Arguing anti-school positions

Apathy Wrote:Thanks fist, this is exactly the sort of thinking that will fix SS.

It's pathetic that this needed to be explained though. It's basic thinking that should be utilised in everyday life.

HELLO STRAT DON"T BE A COWARD! POST UNDER YOUR OLD SCREEN NAME.
01-26-2009 03:02 AM
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Apathy Offline
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Re: Arguing anti-school positions

Even if you think I am Strat, that is unimportant.

See the message, not the person.
01-26-2009 03:11 AM
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KitsuneSefam Offline
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Post: #9
Re: Arguing anti-school positions

It's hard to have a argument with a pro-school person, for myself, it will always end up with the same CD playing over and over;

1."If you don't get a diploma, you work at McDonalds."

-> If I debunk this, I'l get something like...

"Sure there are exceptions in dropouts but most aren't successful and end up working at McDonalds."

2."But school if for socializing"

-> If I debunk this, Il get something like this

"You can't deny that all the friends you have now is those you met in school, school is the best place for socializing."

3."You learn things at school"

-> If I debunk this

"But kids have no interests and if they wouldn't go to school they'd be on their sofa watching TV all day, I'm living proof of it."(Notice how this went off-topic, we went from learning to interests.)

These are the 3 off my head.
01-26-2009 05:51 AM
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Liquid Offline
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Post: #10
Re: Arguing anti-school positions

I never get to the argument stage...

Me: "Hello, want to help me destroy the educational system?"

Other Guy: "Um... Gotta go..." *runs away at full speed*

//

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02-05-2009 09:06 AM
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Reptorian Offline
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Post: #11
Re: Arguing anti-school positions

KitsuneSefam Wrote:"But kids have no interests and if they wouldn't go to school they'd be on their sofa watching TV all day, I'm living proof of it."(Notice how this went off-topic, we went from learning to interests.)

Some people are just lazy due to the habits caused by the environment, the way they are raised and the chemicals in their body and other factors which is connected to the body.But however,there are kids who have interest in attempting to learn things at school and there are also those who don't feel like learning things at school while they are acknowledging they learn better at home. It may depends on the person characteristics, environment, biological age within the chemicals reaction inside the body and the way he/she was raised thus results in different results such as learning at home getting an education or going into watching TV while playing computer so you wouldn't be able to judge how the person will react if they haven't went to school. There are more than 2 million homeschooling people and there are so many unschooled people which results in that there are plenty of evidence the huge amount of people involved within these groups do not go on sofa being lazy all day, but rather try learning at their own paces usually. In history, it has been observed that there are people who learns without the needs of going inside an building 5 times a week and become very educated such as Albert Einstein who learns at his own paces right after dropping out of elementary school(I think) and went to prove his genius at the university and there are people that aren't as smart as Albert Einstein become educated without the need of having too much teaching from another people in 18 years

KitsuneSefam Wrote:-> If I debunk this, Il get something like this

"You can't deny that all the friends you have now is those you met in school, school is the best place for socializing."

Due to the population count and the limited communication in class, the students will not communicate in the most efficient way compared to those who aren't students in the school method and there are issues that affects communication skills to students such as partial deafness which will not allow them to learn communication and they are stuck to learning to do it for more than 14 years if it was from birth and they are better off communicating at home while traveling outside doing social activity since there are less noises to time ratio than the public school method. It has been clinically proven that socialization happens anywhere. In the Thomas Smedley research of homeschooling vs public schooling, it is found that those who are sent to school are less mature and less socialized than those who don't go to school while Dr. Gary Knowles proves more than 90 percents of home educated people are more independent thus there is an whole lot of people who don't go school are mature, educated, independent as an result of analyzing their researches. If you take an look at the people who go to school while analyzing what they are speaking, you will find them to be immature with errors on their writing if you are smart enough and mature enough to think it by simply analyzing the ridiculousness of their conversation. One example of the ridiculousness of the conversation is that 3 girls talking to me about vaginas and sexual pleasure while they are not acting properly during an sex-related topic while the other just talks about drugs and actually doing drugs not using proper verbal grammar. You can have friends anywhere else other than school using the technology and your brain to meet other people while finding out their information in order to have them to meet you.

KitsuneSefam Wrote:1."If you don't get a diploma, you work at McDonalds."
-> If I debunk this, I'l get something like...

Nowaday, we are seeing that there are more graduates who are working at an menial jobs while there are dropouts working at an menial job as well simply because of the economy crisis and the lack of communication skills. There are jobs that don't require diplomas but huge amount of skills is required such as the freelance 3D modeling job which is an job to work at home and getting paid very well if they do pay you very much and also diploma don't increase the money earning in freelance job or selling stuff online, it all requires mathematical knowledge which you can learn at any place if you desire to do so and if the learning method works for you. Online jobs are nowaday becoming more common and that is how people are surviving. Try getting an diploma only and get an work at an art field without any good portfolio and you'll be getting paid lower than those who are into an job and there are graduates who cannot find an job for more than 9 months. In order to survive this country having an job, you need to have the thinking ability well developed enough to find clues to that job that you need. There are dropouts who are earning million of dollars without the needs of an degree, but they do need knowledge on starting the business while being the founder of that business. It has been proven that there are graduates who earn from very low-very high 100000 dollars an year while dropouts from very low-very high amount of money per years. If you take an look at the street, you'll be finding graduates who earns an degree working at walmart and you'll be finding intelligence people ranting about not getting paid well even though they got an kickass degree.

ZZZ...
06-09-2009 09:50 AM
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random_name Offline
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Post: #12
Re: Arguing anti-school positions

Apathy Wrote:Even if you think I am Strat, that is unimportant.

See the message, not the person.

SUP APATHY

Anyway, this is win. Thanks =D

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06-09-2009 06:46 PM
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Loxor Offline
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Re: Arguing anti-school positions

It'd be best if people had examples for what the were arguing against, like sucessfull highschool drop outs, Zero Tolerance fails.

People need to look at other's view taking into account how they could be biased, or basing things on a one time experience.

(Wait, this is a bump, Razz )

Anything that ever happened or will... one condition, it has to be amazing.

I gave her wings but she don't wanna fly no more.

I'm sittin' on the dock of the bay
Watching the tide roll away
Ooo, I'm just sittin' on the dock of the bay
Wastin' time
02-03-2010 12:04 PM
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magikarp Offline
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Post: #14
Re: Arguing anti-school positions

Loxor Wrote:It'd be best if people had examples for what the were arguing against, like sucessfull highschool drop outs...
Nah. Even a list of 1000 successful drop-outs wouldn't help your case much because possibility of being successful without high school is much less relevant than the probability of it.

"Do we treat straight public sex differently than we do gay public sex? Of course. Straight people are so proud of their public sex that they named a cocktail after it."
02-04-2010 06:36 AM
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Geeksta Offline
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Re: Arguing anti-school positions

Even then, we would need statistics, where as the pro-school arguments can be based on "Well, everyone knows..." So of course they will (almost) always win

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04-14-2011 09:24 PM
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Dallasotis Offline
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Re: Arguing anti-school positions

Chidslren you should go to school because if you dont you will become an ailsma
04-14-2011 09:27 PM
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IamNoone Offline
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Post: #17
RE: Arguing anti-school positions

We don't even need statistics, although they would help.
Our best arguments are
1. Psychological studies.
2. Why school was made in the first place, emphasizing how it has not changed with the time.
3. Psychological profiles of Schoolers vs. Homeschoolers
4 School works for all of the wrong reasons.

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So I’d rather die for a cause than live a life that is worthless
I don’t need the circus or the day of national observance
I need you to think for you and stop being a servant
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02-18-2012 03:34 AM
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AtheistLGBTQAnarchist Offline
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Post: #18
Arguing anti-school positions

I miss old SS.Also I will steal your name one day magikarp.There can only be one magikarp boy thats sort of a girl around here.

Congratulations humanity,because you refuse to let go of the old and evolve you actually make people believe in 2012. Not only that, but you're the only species on Earth that were able to make it possible, now we get to sit until we die because we couldn't get to Mars. We have failed as a society and don't deserve our gifts to survive for this long. Maybe this is why dinosaurs are extinct, we sure aren't any better than the dirt you say we're created from. http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=pla...DvwSOFto#! Noo

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09-29-2012 10:25 AM
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thesupremeanarchist Offline
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RE: Arguing anti-school positions

(01-26-2009 05:51 AM)KitsuneSefam Wrote:  It's hard to have a argument with a pro-school person, for myself, it will always end up with the same CD playing over and over;

1."If you don't get a diploma, you work at McDonalds."

-> If I debunk this, I'l get something like...

"Sure there are exceptions in dropouts but most aren't successful and end up working at McDonalds."

2."But school if for socializing"

-> If I debunk this, Il get something like this

"You can't deny that all the friends you have now is those you met in school, school is the best place for socializing."

3."You learn things at school"

-> If I debunk this

"But kids have no interests and if they wouldn't go to school they'd be on their sofa watching TV all day, I'm living proof of it."(Notice how this went off-topic, we went from learning to interests.)

These are the 3 off my head.
Yep. That's right. Everyone says 'you need to stay in school to get an education'.

-> I debunk this with a short list of famous people that dropped out of school.

'You won't make anything of yourself if you don't go to school.'

Oh, and the dykes who don't even listen to you, tuning you out and basically saying 'fuck you'. And, you really don't learn shit in school. Nothing that will help you survive. I can't stand those pro-school idiots, expecially when they say 'you're going and you're going to like it.' Ever have one of those dyke-assed pinkos tell you that? Especially when they didn't follow what they preached.

Most of the people I know that went to school either A) came out heroin addicts with IQs of ten, or B) are now working minimum wage and broke. Sad, maybe, but true.

Everything you put in that list is true. No ifs, ands or buts about it. But, I really hate it and get frustrated when I feel nobody sees my POV.

666 Baby Annihilator.
(This post was last modified: 06-21-2015 09:43 AM by thesupremeanarchist.)
06-21-2015 09:38 AM
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brainiac3397 Offline
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Post: #20
Arguing anti-school positions

I'm not sure the sample you'd use for that statistical viewpoint would be considered accurate. Just because most people "you" know became addicts or work minimum wage doesn't mean it applies to everyone.

Secondly, there are always "ifs and buts". You take a hard stance on the other side, you're no different from the opposition other than the fact you're on the other side of the coin. In the end, both radical sides are just bullshitting demagogues who inherently emphasize a ideologue and emotional approach. Could be blamed on the school systems too since people get the idea that "the loudest bark is right".

Dropping out, while not inherently the cause of failure in life, still decreases your chance of achieving success. Why? Because that's just how the world works and will always work. The concept of schooling also exists so that a "arbitrator" between you, the student, and society itself exists. This arbitrator is the teacher and their fundamental purpose is not just to educate, but supervise to ensure that you understand the education. That's basically what a grade is meant to represent(at least theoretical. Realistically school is at bare-minimum doing said fundamental job with all the obsession with other crap).

The best way to argue for dropping out is not using others as examples. Nobody gives a shit. You aren't those people. You're you. So point out why and how YOU will be successful. Otherwise you're getting into some cliched arguement millions of people have probably had.

As for socializing, some people do in fact benefit from being stuffed into a building with a common purpose for 8 hours a day. Perhaps you're intensely introverted and it comes good(since we all know different people are affected differently). Perhaps you live in like some rural area where the closest human is miles away(or you have a small number of nearby folk you see all the time). In such a case, school would indeed bring you together with other people. That being said I don't think people should be even talking about what places are best for socializing. The addiction to social media and electronic devices is, while basically an increase in socializing, is IMO destructive to personal socialization. Did I mention how much I hate it when people walk around wearing goddamn earphones?

School is intended for learning, and up to a certain point you do learn. However, the ideals and values of America tend to clash with the rigidity of schools. We're taught to be unique, creative, thinking individuals...then go to school to do as everyone else. Schools need to become more flexible at the point where students begin to seek their own interests out.

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(06-14-2013 08:02 AM)Potato Wrote:  watch the fuq out, we've got an "intellectual" over here.

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06-21-2015 11:41 AM
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Hansgrohe Offline
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Arguing anti-school positions

Moved to more relevant section

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Stop jerking off to porn and whining and do something about it

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