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August 2001 - June 2017
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To everyone who joined these forums at some point, and got discouraged by the negativity and left after a while (or even got literally scared off): I'm sorry.
I wasn't good enough at encouraging people to be kinder, and removing people who refuse to be kind. Encouraging people is hard, and removing people creates conflict, and I hate conflict... so that's why I wasn't better at it.
I was a very, very sensitive teen. The atmosphere of this forum as it is now, if it had existed in 1996, would probably have upset me far more than it would have helped.
I can handle quite a lot of negativity and even abuse now, but that isn't the point. I want to help people. I want to help the people who need it the most, and I want to help people like the 1996 version of me.
I'm still figuring out the best way to do that, but as it is now, these forums are doing more harm than good, and I can't keep running them.
Thank you to the few people who have tried to understand my point of view so far. I really, really appreciate you guys. You are beautiful people.
Everyone else: If after everything I've said so far, you still don't understand my motivations, I think it's unlikely that you will. We're just too different. Maybe someday in the future it might make sense, but until then, there's no point in arguing about it. I don't have the time or the energy for arguing anymore. I will focus my time and energy on people who support me, and those who need help.
-SoulRiser
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I don't know, I am mixed on the subject. On one hand, I don't really agree with it, but I wouldn't say its the path of cowards. I think I'll take a shot at it though.
I disagree because it takes some serious stones to actually go through with it, I'm not saying that suicide is just; I think it to be a very selfish course of action, but I wouldn't say it is cowardly either.
Do not let a moment go by that doesn't remind you that your heart beats 900 times a day and that there are enough gallons of blood to make you an ocean.
Its a person's life and they can do whatever they want with it whether they live it or end it who gives a shit about titles that only have meaning to the living whether they be heroic or cowardly a corpse doesn't care for those.
Its easy to be selfish and try to force someone to live life through some speech you give them because it'll hurt others but a real close person gives them the thick and thin about how life has its ups and downs and gives the final choice to said person.
Now if I wanted to kill myself I would an hero and do something awesome like blow up some walmarts or something.
I wouldn't call it cowardly, but I would definitely call it irrational and really stupid.
I think Buenaventura Durruti is a pretty cool guy. eh kills fascists and doesnt afraid of ruins. The quickest way to kill a revolution is to wait for it.
What I most commonly hear from people is either that suicide is a deliberate coward's way out or that it's a deliberately brave way out. In some few cases it may be deliberate, but for the most part, suicide is actually the product of immense psychological trauma or stress resulting in the delusional, often unconscious, conclusion that death is the only way to end the pain. This is why, despite my other beliefs regarding individual rights, I don't believe that a suicidal person should be let alone to do what they will; they more often than not are not of sound mind and cannot make a truly beneficial decision for themselves.
I'm against suicide in most cases, not because I think I have any right to anyone's life, but because it's almost always not a rational decision. For the same reason, I don't blame a successful suicide for the grieving survivors or other results of their action.
Sources:
1. This one book I read one time and can't remember the title of pp. x-y
I understand your point of view Jack but I believe in something called taking responsibility for your own actions even if its not rational and there are people who death would be preferable to their lives.
I get what you mean. I'm really undecided on whether one should be physically stopped from committing suicide. I'm certainly not against any amount of trying to convince the person not to do it, but I may never be sure of what measures we should feel entitled to take beyond that.
Depends on your definition of suicide.
If you see it as a cowardly way to get away from all ones problems and commitements, then yes that is cowardly.
If you see it as, each person has control over themselves and if they can not handle how their life is, or how they fit into this world, then why shouldn't they be able to end their torment?
What about people who are suffering from an incurable disease, and just want to end the pain? Are they cowardly for ending it early, saving time, money and suffering.
but like I said, it is all about your definition of suicide.
Suicide is only speeding up the inevitable, we will all come to that same fate so ultimately, it doesn't matter. A dead body doesn't care if its death was cowardly or not, and even so, we do not know what happens after death anyway.
However, the world and life itself is fascinating and there is so much to learn and do, I would prefer that I live it rather than not. Even though we won't remember, I live for now and look forward to what death may bring.
I don't agree. People say things like "Only cowards do that, you're weak if you kill yourself", "God has a plan for you", "It'll get better", and "Your selfish for even thinking that, what will your family say/think/do?"
I don't think it's cowardly to kill yourself, I think you're smart if you do. Would you rather live in extreme poverty for the rest of your life or just end it? The world would be a better place if people like Seung-Hui Cho could just take themselves out if they want.
Not everyone is a Christian, why would they care?
How do you know it'll get better?
I think the family is somewhat selfish if they want the person to be alive when they don't want to.
If I saw someone trying to commit suicide, I would just say "Are you really, really sure? and walk away. I would never try to prevent someone's suicide attempt.
I would ask if they're sure, yes. I would also ask why. I would pick apart their reasons, challenge their assumptions, and suggest alternatives. I would do everything I can either to convince them not to do it or to help them determine that it really is the best thing for them, but in the end it's not my place to physically stop them.
12-15-2010 09:32 AM
Thanks given by:
Miller0700
Here to save you.
Posts: 3,405
Joined: Oct 2010
Jack Wrote:What I most commonly hear from people is either that suicide is a deliberate coward's way out or that it's a deliberately brave way out. In some few cases it may be deliberate, but for the most part, suicide is actually the product of immense psychological trauma or stress resulting in the delusional, often unconscious, conclusion that death is the only way to end the pain. This is why, despite my other beliefs regarding individual rights, I don't believe that a suicidal person should be let alone to do what they will; they more often than not are not of sound mind and cannot make a truly beneficial decision for themselves.
I'm against suicide in most cases, not because I think I have any right to anyone's life, but because it's almost always not a rational decision. For the same reason, I don't blame a successful suicide for the grieving survivors or other results of their action.
Sources:
1. This one book I read one time and can't remember the title of pp. x-y
A coward's death? Tell that to the samurai who performed sepakuku, or suicide. They preferred killing themselves to be taken in by the enemy or being defeated. To them, that was honor, and surrendering was a cowardly choice.
Funny how different things are from the Christian viewpoint.
Sorry to sound pretentious, I'm just fed up with the Catholic bullshit I've been listening to for years. Sadly, I've attempted suicide. The first time was really just an attention stunt, so I don't think that counts. The second time, I tried to hang myself, but my brother came in and tackled me, holding me down until I promised not to attempt it again. I was an extremely moodly 14 year old, and he was actually stronger than me. I wanted to escape responsibility and honestly felt that no one gave a shit, so what was the point living if I didn't mean anything? My brother's interference helped and forced me to think things over and take control of my life.
I wouldn't call suicide cowardly, but in most cases, it is irrational. Random fact: some countries are charging for suicide crisis calls. People who just sit there and haven't actually dealt with real shit think it's so easy to not be suicidal, so they're quick to judge and assume it's something you can "get over." Suicide isn't rational, but being a sanctimonious dick about it doesn't help.
People may think its selfish to want to kill yourself, but you know whats ACTUALLY selfish? Forcing someone to live in torment just because they make you feel better about yourself.
Hidden stuff:
TRIGGER WARNING: THIS TRIGGER WARNING CONTAINS TRIGGER WARNINGS!
Dear Tumblrites:Despite your wrongly self-diagnosedPTSD, no line ofscientific evidencesuggests people can be triggered over theinternet. Triggering works through thesenses(i.e. smell, taste, touch, vision, hearing.) but it goes throughreal time; if you're not experiencing it in real life as it'sACTUALLY HAPPENINGin yourACTUALlife, youCANNOTbe triggered. The only exception to this is if you have aseizure, but then again, that's triggered byepilepsy(i.e. rapidly-changing flashing lights)NOT PTSD. Remembering a bad incident is NOT the same thing as having aflashback. When you remember, youthink; when youflashback,youfeel.
#HashTagsAreForIdiots
Max Stirnir Wrote:"In the time of spirits thoughts grew till they overtopped my head, whose offspring they yet were; they hovered about me and convulsed me like fever-phantasies -- an awful power. The thoughts had become corporeal on their own account, were ghosts, e. g. God, Emperor, Pope, Fatherland, etc. If I destroy their corporeity, then I take them back into mine, and say: "I alone am corporeal." And now I take the world as what it is to me, as mine, as my property; I refer all to myself."The Ego and Its Own, pg. 15
Charles Manson Wrote:“Look down at me and you see a fool;
look up at me and you see a god;
look straight at me and you see yourself”
HeartofShadows Wrote:"Life is nothing more than a druggie trying to get their quick fix of happiness while dealing with the harsh withdrawal of reality"
Osip Mandelstam Wrote:"I divide all of world literature into authorized and unauthorized works. The former are all trash; the latter--stolen air. I want to spit in the face of every writer who first obtains permission and then writes."The Fourth Prose, 1930.
Lukas Foss Wrote:That is why the analogy of stealing does not work. With a thief, we want to know how much money he stole, and from whom. With the artist it is not how much he took and from whom, but what he did with it.
Sociopath Wrote:People may think its selfish to want to kill yourself, but you know whats ACTUALLY selfish? Forcing someone to live in torment just because they make you feel better about yourself.
Actually a pretty good point.
12-15-2010 09:53 PM
Thanks given by:
Miller0700
Here to save you.
Posts: 3,405
Joined: Oct 2010
Sociopath Wrote:People may think its selfish to want to kill yourself, but you know whats ACTUALLY selfish? Forcing someone to live in torment just because they make you feel better about yourself.
Kind of agree with you, but this person could get some help. Its stupidity to just sit there and be tormented without getting some help to change that situation.
Sociopath Wrote:People may think its selfish to want to kill yourself, but you know whats ACTUALLY selfish? Forcing someone to live in torment just because they make you feel better about yourself.
So the person can't get any help? If they're obviously in pain and just want to die without even trying to make things better, that's fucking stupid.
Hidden stuff:
(11-27-2011 01:00 PM)psychopath Wrote:
(11-27-2011 10:52 AM)Efs Wrote: Our Army is more professional than Amerika.
Except ours isn't allowed to have guns
CrayolaColours Wrote:That post owned. TDF wins post of the year.
Faby Wrote:
krissy Wrote:dessert fox
Mmm, flambéed vulpine.
"There is no enemy, there is no victory, only boys who lost their lives in the sand."
[/center]
Derchin Wrote:Kind of agree with you, but this person could get some help. Its stupidity to just sit there and be tormented without getting some help to change that situation.
Look at what help is nowadays.
Shrinks who give no rats ass about you and people who will mock and jeer you because they figure you want attention and even people who look at you all differently once they find out whether it be through fear or disgust. Some people aren't as pathetic as to suicide over attention.
Lets not forget about the good old drugs they put you on too.
The Desert Fox Wrote:So the person can't get any help? If they're obviously in pain and just want to die without even trying to make things better, that's fucking stupid.
People try sometimes(least some do) desert but they eventually exhaust their options.
Why live when you don't give a rats ass about love, family, careers, money or the like.
Some people are simply tired and just want sleep and peace.
I felt the same way in high school.
Sociopath Wrote:People may think its selfish to want to kill yourself, but you know whats ACTUALLY selfish? Forcing someone to live in torment just because they make you feel better about yourself.
So the person can't get any help? If they're obviously in pain and just want to die without even trying to make things better, that's fucking stupid.
Ah, good ol' TDF: assuming things I didn't even say! How DOES he do it...?
Hidden stuff:
TRIGGER WARNING: THIS TRIGGER WARNING CONTAINS TRIGGER WARNINGS!
Dear Tumblrites:Despite your wrongly self-diagnosedPTSD, no line ofscientific evidencesuggests people can be triggered over theinternet. Triggering works through thesenses(i.e. smell, taste, touch, vision, hearing.) but it goes throughreal time; if you're not experiencing it in real life as it'sACTUALLY HAPPENINGin yourACTUALlife, youCANNOTbe triggered. The only exception to this is if you have aseizure, but then again, that's triggered byepilepsy(i.e. rapidly-changing flashing lights)NOT PTSD. Remembering a bad incident is NOT the same thing as having aflashback. When you remember, youthink; when youflashback,youfeel.
#HashTagsAreForIdiots
Max Stirnir Wrote:"In the time of spirits thoughts grew till they overtopped my head, whose offspring they yet were; they hovered about me and convulsed me like fever-phantasies -- an awful power. The thoughts had become corporeal on their own account, were ghosts, e. g. God, Emperor, Pope, Fatherland, etc. If I destroy their corporeity, then I take them back into mine, and say: "I alone am corporeal." And now I take the world as what it is to me, as mine, as my property; I refer all to myself."The Ego and Its Own, pg. 15
Charles Manson Wrote:“Look down at me and you see a fool;
look up at me and you see a god;
look straight at me and you see yourself”
HeartofShadows Wrote:"Life is nothing more than a druggie trying to get their quick fix of happiness while dealing with the harsh withdrawal of reality"
Osip Mandelstam Wrote:"I divide all of world literature into authorized and unauthorized works. The former are all trash; the latter--stolen air. I want to spit in the face of every writer who first obtains permission and then writes."The Fourth Prose, 1930.
Lukas Foss Wrote:That is why the analogy of stealing does not work. With a thief, we want to know how much money he stole, and from whom. With the artist it is not how much he took and from whom, but what he did with it.
Sociopath Wrote:People may think its selfish to want to kill yourself, but you know whats ACTUALLY selfish? Forcing someone to live in torment just because they make you feel better about yourself.
So the person can't get any help? If they're obviously in pain and just want to die without even trying to make things better, that's fucking stupid.
Ah, good ol' TDF: assuming things I didn't even say! How DOES he do it...?
I see you haven't changed a bit.
Hidden stuff:
(11-27-2011 01:00 PM)psychopath Wrote:
(11-27-2011 10:52 AM)Efs Wrote: Our Army is more professional than Amerika.
Except ours isn't allowed to have guns
CrayolaColours Wrote:That post owned. TDF wins post of the year.
Faby Wrote:
krissy Wrote:dessert fox
Mmm, flambéed vulpine.
"There is no enemy, there is no victory, only boys who lost their lives in the sand."
[/center]
I'm trying out this "reverse psychology" thing: I'm acting like you to show you just how faulty you are.
Now leave this thread, or I will shoot you with my plastic gun.
Hidden stuff:
TRIGGER WARNING: THIS TRIGGER WARNING CONTAINS TRIGGER WARNINGS!
Dear Tumblrites:Despite your wrongly self-diagnosedPTSD, no line ofscientific evidencesuggests people can be triggered over theinternet. Triggering works through thesenses(i.e. smell, taste, touch, vision, hearing.) but it goes throughreal time; if you're not experiencing it in real life as it'sACTUALLY HAPPENINGin yourACTUALlife, youCANNOTbe triggered. The only exception to this is if you have aseizure, but then again, that's triggered byepilepsy(i.e. rapidly-changing flashing lights)NOT PTSD. Remembering a bad incident is NOT the same thing as having aflashback. When you remember, youthink; when youflashback,youfeel.
#HashTagsAreForIdiots
Max Stirnir Wrote:"In the time of spirits thoughts grew till they overtopped my head, whose offspring they yet were; they hovered about me and convulsed me like fever-phantasies -- an awful power. The thoughts had become corporeal on their own account, were ghosts, e. g. God, Emperor, Pope, Fatherland, etc. If I destroy their corporeity, then I take them back into mine, and say: "I alone am corporeal." And now I take the world as what it is to me, as mine, as my property; I refer all to myself."The Ego and Its Own, pg. 15
Charles Manson Wrote:“Look down at me and you see a fool;
look up at me and you see a god;
look straight at me and you see yourself”
HeartofShadows Wrote:"Life is nothing more than a druggie trying to get their quick fix of happiness while dealing with the harsh withdrawal of reality"
Osip Mandelstam Wrote:"I divide all of world literature into authorized and unauthorized works. The former are all trash; the latter--stolen air. I want to spit in the face of every writer who first obtains permission and then writes."The Fourth Prose, 1930.
Lukas Foss Wrote:That is why the analogy of stealing does not work. With a thief, we want to know how much money he stole, and from whom. With the artist it is not how much he took and from whom, but what he did with it.
TRIGGER WARNING: THIS TRIGGER WARNING CONTAINS TRIGGER WARNINGS!
Dear Tumblrites:Despite your wrongly self-diagnosedPTSD, no line ofscientific evidencesuggests people can be triggered over theinternet. Triggering works through thesenses(i.e. smell, taste, touch, vision, hearing.) but it goes throughreal time; if you're not experiencing it in real life as it'sACTUALLY HAPPENINGin yourACTUALlife, youCANNOTbe triggered. The only exception to this is if you have aseizure, but then again, that's triggered byepilepsy(i.e. rapidly-changing flashing lights)NOT PTSD. Remembering a bad incident is NOT the same thing as having aflashback. When you remember, youthink; when youflashback,youfeel.
#HashTagsAreForIdiots
Max Stirnir Wrote:"In the time of spirits thoughts grew till they overtopped my head, whose offspring they yet were; they hovered about me and convulsed me like fever-phantasies -- an awful power. The thoughts had become corporeal on their own account, were ghosts, e. g. God, Emperor, Pope, Fatherland, etc. If I destroy their corporeity, then I take them back into mine, and say: "I alone am corporeal." And now I take the world as what it is to me, as mine, as my property; I refer all to myself."The Ego and Its Own, pg. 15
Charles Manson Wrote:“Look down at me and you see a fool;
look up at me and you see a god;
look straight at me and you see yourself”
HeartofShadows Wrote:"Life is nothing more than a druggie trying to get their quick fix of happiness while dealing with the harsh withdrawal of reality"
Osip Mandelstam Wrote:"I divide all of world literature into authorized and unauthorized works. The former are all trash; the latter--stolen air. I want to spit in the face of every writer who first obtains permission and then writes."The Fourth Prose, 1930.
Lukas Foss Wrote:That is why the analogy of stealing does not work. With a thief, we want to know how much money he stole, and from whom. With the artist it is not how much he took and from whom, but what he did with it.