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Hello from a teacher - TheCancer - 12-06-2009 01:08 AM

Hello disgruntled students. Let me start off by saying I am not a troll or a liar. I'm a special education middle school teacher in a low-income medium sized urban area in the United States. Sadly, a lot of students like yourselves have grown to hate me. I often wonder if being a part of a compulsory school system makes me part of the problem or part of the solution. It's very important to me to make my living without causing harm to others. I would never be a part of the military, be a part of any kind of war effort or be involved in the creation or distribution of anything that is harmful to humanity or the environment. I got into special education because I wanted to help people with disabilities. And I have helped a lot of young people.

I have also been met with a lot of hostility from students who, in my opinion, have no disability what-so-ever and just plain hate school so they naturally see me as some kind of enemy. However deeply these students do not want to be taught by me, be assurred that I want to teach them even less. I am entirely opposed to compulsory education. If you do not want to be there I do not want you there. I do not want to force anything on anyone ever. I also think students who suppossedly do want to be in school but are frequently disruptive should be quickly expelled from the tradition environment and given some kind of alternative.


There's a lot of things wrong. Students shouldn't be forced to take classes they don't want to take and on the other hand they shouldn't be allowed to take classes they can't handle. I hate being asked to teach algebra to students who still can't multiply and divide, for example. No wonder negative behaviors start brewing! Also, outside of education I am very socially libertarian as well. I believe that drugs should be legalized as it should be an individual's personal choice what he does with his own body. As for minors, drug use is between you and your parents, the government should stay out of it.


On the other hand, I deeply despise violence and think that people who commit violent crimes should be removed from society by means of execution. From an economic standpoint I believe that if the government is going to create a world where people need money to survive they should also provide people with the money. I know even young people will scoff at that kind of idealism but that's my take. Everyone should be provided with a place to live, nutritious food, health care and access to a free education just on the grounds that people have value therefore should be cared for. Well, that's a bit of my story. Maybe I can help some of you see things from a different angle. I know I can learn a lot from the people here as well.

Peace.


Re: Hello from a teacher - Specter - 12-06-2009 01:09 AM

0/10


Re: Hello from a teacher - psychopath - 12-06-2009 01:09 AM

You're a troll, epic fail. A teacher wouldn't come here and claim that they're not a troll.

This is obvious as fuck


Re: Hello from a teacher - Pieman - 12-06-2009 01:10 AM

Welcome. We've had a few teachers here before, and they've made for interesting conversations.


Re: Hello from a teacher - Faby - 12-06-2009 01:12 AM

Your username and the content of your post make me lulz. It goes without saying*, but gtfo.

Fuck.


Re: Hello from a teacher - TheCancer - 12-06-2009 01:27 AM

Quote:A teacher wouldn't come here and claim that they're not a troll.

Why not?


Re: Hello from a teacher - TheCancer - 12-06-2009 01:28 AM

Faby Wrote:Your username and the content of your post make me lulz. It goes without saying*, but gtfo.

Fuck.

Well, I'm glad you see the irony in my name. It's intentional and meant to be self-critical.


Re: Hello from a teacher - Ceiling Cat - 12-06-2009 01:58 AM

Your username rather reminds me of 4chan...

Anyway, if this isn't trolling, I'd like to play some arcade Arkanoid. With your arguments as blocks.

TheCancer Wrote:I often wonder if being a part of a compulsory school system makes me part of the problem or part of the solution.

Very funny, indeed. It depends, as some teachers are batshit insane about their classes, and every such one wants their field of teaching to be the "most important". And yes, they even resort to shoving it down your throat in hopes you'll thank them someday.


TheCancer Wrote:It's very important to me to make my living without causing harm to others.

Have you ever seen "Dead Poets' Society"? It's obvious that the administration is often at fault, not a teacher. And the latter ones are afraid of making things interesting, because it's 'not in the program'.

TheCancer Wrote:I have also been met with a lot of hostility from students who, in my opinion, have no disability what-so-ever and just plain hate school so they naturally see me as some kind of enemy.

There must be a reason. For example, it might not be your fault but your job still requires forcing material and bad grades on the students who can't even understand it. They suffer from it, and you keep your job. Is this fair?

TheCancer Wrote:However deeply these students do not want to be taught by me, be assurred that I want to teach them even less. I am entirely opposed to compulsory education. If you do not want to be there I do not want you there. I do not want to force anything on anyone ever. I also think students who suppossedly do want to be in school but are frequently disruptive should be quickly expelled from the tradition environment and given some kind of alternative.

The alternatives we have in today's world... let's see: becoming a bum, going to a crappy apprenticeship which is still school, and being forcibly sent to a boarding school by parents.

TheCancer Wrote:There's a lot of things wrong. Students shouldn't be forced to take classes they don't want to take and on the other hand they shouldn't be allowed to take classes they can't handle. I hate being asked to teach algebra to students who still can't multiply and divide, for example. No wonder negative behaviors start brewing! Also, outside of education I am very socially libertarian as well. I believe that drugs should be legalized as it should be an individual's personal choice what he does with his own body. As for minors, drug use is between you and your parents, the government should stay out of it.

But you still force it on them. If you don't want to, change your job! Oh wait, your HS diploma can be shoved up your butt, as you still won't get a job.

TheCancer Wrote:On the other hand, I deeply despise violence and think that people who commit violent crimes should be removed from society by means of execution.

Even if it's the system that makes people violent in the first place? Grrrrreat. Conform or die, is that what you want?

TheCancer Wrote:From an economic standpoint I believe that if the government is going to create a world where people need money to survive they should also provide people with the money. I know even young people will scoff at that kind of idealism but that's my take. Everyone should be provided with a place to live, nutritious food, health care and access to a free education just on the grounds that people have value therefore should be cared for. Well, that's a bit of my story. Maybe I can help some of you see things from a different angle. I know I can learn a lot from the people here as well.

Peace.

You forgot something... freedom of choice, maybe? Or, you're out of school already and hence you don't even give a flying fuck about those who still are brainwashed there?
And you even help the process. It's disgusting.


Did I set a new highscore?


Re: Hello from a teacher - Sunbourn - 12-06-2009 02:40 AM

Lol @ arguing with a teacher who seems to largely agree with us. Way to go guys.


Re: Hello from a teacher - MorikoMisa - 12-06-2009 03:14 AM

A teacher, that agrees, with US!? This is breaking news guys, come on, back up is on the waaaaaay!

Welcome, I really hope you're not a troll, for it would be sort of interesting to see things from a teacher's point of view.


Re: Hello from a teacher - TheCancer - 12-06-2009 03:36 AM

Quote:There must be a reason. For example, it might not be your fault but your job still requires forcing material and bad grades on the students who can't even understand it. They suffer from it, and you keep your job. Is this fair?

I'm in special ed. so the accountability to the grading system doesn't have to be so intensely adhered to and you may not believe this but I give all my students A's and I tell them that no matter what they do I will give them all A's in my classes. It concerns me that administration could call me to task and ask me how I justify my grading system but so far this hasn't happened. I also spend a lot of time at school trying to convince the general ed. teachers to pass failing students or allow them an easy way to make up their grades. I swear to you this: I will never fail a student who tries and wants to pass. You might not believe that there's any teacher out there who thinks like this. I never had one when I was a student but that's how I run my classes.


Re: Hello from a teacher - Night - 12-06-2009 03:40 AM

the way some people acted makes me afraid to say that i want to be a teacher.
Oh crap.
*hides*


Re: Hello from a teacher - TheCancer - 12-06-2009 03:41 AM

Quote:I really hope you're not a troll,

I'm not a troll. I'm just an old tired hippy who passed a few certification exams and got a job as a teacher. All I want to do is make things better and easier for all of us.


Re: Hello from a teacher - Night - 12-06-2009 03:43 AM

TheCancer Wrote:
Quote:I really hope you're not a troll,

I'm not a troll. I'm just an old tired hippy who passed a few certification exams and got a job as a teacher. All I want to do is make things better and easier for all of us.
YAY HIPPY!


Re: Hello from a teacher - psychopath - 12-06-2009 03:43 AM

A teacher that doesn't know how to use paragraphs, claims is not a troll before anyone asks, "The Cancer"...too many troll signs. But as always, SS fails to spot a troll


Re: Hello from a teacher - Vatman - 12-06-2009 03:52 AM

We don't consider teachers to be the enemy so much as we see them as the workers of a failing system. The current school system as it stands has been made to educate the general public. General of course is the key word here, and don't think I wont twist it to prove my point. I most assuredly will.

People are general, and schools are most undoubtedly filled with people. But is a person general? I think not. Generally each person on this board consumes around 1700-2500 calories of food each day, but I doubt everyone eats the same thing. Strange examples aside: even if generally people are able to stand 4-6 hours of schooling per day. Is it really fair to assume that each one of them would do well in the same general program.

I know you as a special ed teacher has less say in the system then a circumsized raccoon would...but the mere fact that you work in a system that supports group think and by association discourages individuality... Makes you just as bad as a "General" simply following the Fuhrers orders. (I told you I would twist...I'm very honest about twisting.)


Re: Hello from a teacher - TheCancer - 12-06-2009 03:53 AM

night.artist Wrote:the way some people acted makes me afraid to say that i want to be a teacher.
Oh crap.
*hides*

I've gotten pretty good at getting students involved in the educational activities that I provide but the most frustrating thing for me is when I work hard to prepare an interesting lesson and a few students ruin it by refusing to be quiet. That's why I don't think they should be forced to be in there.

Another thing that I find really annoying is that the things most of my difficult students talk about are just plain stupid. Mostly, about fighting. It makes me think they're like ruffians from the 1940's or something. Like they're in some old black and white movie going to a 'rumble' against the 'greasers' or something. They take it so seriously but really it's a silly teeny bopper joke.

On the other hand, one of my students actually murdered another one of my students. Then all these kids who never even really knew the kid that got killed acted like he was their best friend or something. One of them photoshopped a picture of the kid who ended up dead with angel wings on him and they started putting that image all over the place. Unfortunately, hardly any of them offered either of them (murdered or deceased) the slightest bit of kindness while they were still alive.


Re: Hello from a teacher - psychopath - 12-06-2009 04:07 AM

Vatman Wrote:but the mere fact that you work in a system that supports group think and by association discourages individuality... Makes you just as bad as a "General" simply following the Fuhrers orders. (I told you I would twist...I'm very honest about twisting.)

+ 1000 respect points. They are still part of the same system.

Sometimes it seems to me like it removes that feeling of being responsible, so they don't feel guilty about it.


Re: Hello from a teacher - xcriteria - 12-06-2009 04:34 AM

|55555| Wrote:Lol @ arguing with a teacher who seems to largely agree with us. Way to go guys.
Yeah, really. I'm pretty surprised at the amount of negativity and blind disrespect in many replies in this thread. Come on, this isn't a troll, and just being a teacher doesn't make one evil. Teachers can provide an incredibly valuable service, at least when there's a good match between teacher and student. Even more so with the ones who want to intelligently discuss the issues.

On the other hand, students can be just as much of a nightmare as teachers, and I know most of you believe that because you aren't all fans of all your fellow students, either. Show a little reflection before you post, eh?

Anyway, TheCancer, welcome. These forums do have the capacity for intelligent discussion, despite most of what you see on here. And new members who start and participate in such discussions go a long way to making that happen. Especially providing a view from the other side. Some people were even lamenting nobody with a different view has been around lately.

The most difficult students really do pose an educational problem, even if you completely reinvent school. A good number of us here hate school but do care about learning, and generally aren't true problem students. (I've been out of school for a long time, but I still care a lot about these issues.)


Re: Hello from a teacher - Vatman - 12-06-2009 04:35 AM

Oh right, I forgot. Welcome.


Re: Hello from a teacher - TheCancer - 12-06-2009 04:40 AM

Vatman Wrote:We don't consider teachers to be the enemy so much as we see them as the workers of a failing system. The current school system as it stands has been made to educate the general public. General of course is the key word here, and don't think I wont twist it to prove my point. I most assuredly will.

People are general, and schools are most undoubtedly filled with people. But is a person general? I think not. Generally each person on this board consumes around 1700-2500 calories of food each day, but I doubt everyone eats the same thing. Strange examples aside: even if generally people are able to stand 4-6 hours of schooling per day. Is it really fair to assume that each one of them would do well in the same general program.

I know you as a special ed teacher has less say in the system then a circumsized raccoon would...but the mere fact that you work in a system that supports group think and by association discourages individuality... Makes you just as bad as a "General" simply following the Fuhrers orders. (I told you I would twist...I'm very honest about twisting.)

Nice. Clever word play. I like that.

Do you think there's any validity to the idea that perhaps I can make a positive change from the inside? I've thought about that, too. I don't absolve myself from that by saying 'Oh, I'm just a cog in the wheel'. Like I stated before, it concerns me that I may be causing harm just by being a part of the system of compulsory education.

I also hate 'group think' and I like to consider the several shades of truth in any idea. I used to teach high school reading which allowed for a stronger diversification of ideas. I feel like I was trying to fight group think not to encourage it. For the most part, the students I taught didn't have any sense of radicalism or original thought. I wasn't threatened by them challenging the status quo I was frightened by how willing they were to buy into it completely.

In another teaching situation, I had one male student of about 16 who dressed like a girl and one day he stomped on an American flag. I heard another teacher tell him the typical spiel about people dying for his rights and that flag and blah blah. Later, I again took him aside and told him I respect his opposition to harmful conformity. So what if I didn't want to be a part of the system? I wouldn't have been there to offer him another and obviously rare 'teacher' perspective. Maybe, I shouldn't be there. Maybe it's better for him to have something to fully rebel against instead of him thinking, 'well maybe not all teachers are that bad'. Maybe it's good for him to be fully angry but I don't want a world full of angry adolescents. I want things to really change. And what am I going to do if I'm not a teacher? I would probably be sweeping the floor in a mall or something. What good am I doing the world then? Really, what should I do? I have to live in this world as well. I have to pay my own way. I don't have a better plan. What do you think you'll being doing when you're in your forties? Will you still care as much as I do?


Re: Hello from a teacher - MorikoMisa - 12-06-2009 06:02 AM

I think I may have found my new idol....


Re: Hello from a teacher - Hanny - 12-06-2009 06:02 AM

Welcome, Mr. Cancer Biggrin

We've had a couple of trolls claiming to be teachers in the past, and a lot of our members are paranoid conspiracy theorists. Please excuse them Biggrin I'm interested to hear your input in this, actually. You seem to be a great person.

Also how the FUCK do you do Histograms-*shot*


Re: Hello from a teacher - Bob Dole - 12-06-2009 06:07 AM

Some of you guys need to get a grip. This isn't 4chan, and you don't barge into people's threads and start attacking them without addressing anything they have to say. Christ, did you even read anything they said?

Oh, btw, cancer is a disease that destroys the body from the inside. A teacher working to change the system from the inside out? Anyone? Bueller?



Anyways, let me start off by saying that I'm anti-school, not anti-education. I feel that the idea of education needs to be separated from the idea of school, and that new alternate methods of educating need to be used, so as to prevent the one-size-fits-all school systems we have today. I've often seen administrators and teachers in schools pay lip service to "different learning styles", but never quite seeming to grasp what that really means. There aren't just students who learn by doing, who learn by seeing, or learn by copying. There are students who do best when given some freedom to figure things out for themselves, students who do best with rote memorization, students who do best when left alone with a library and an internet connection. There are some that just want to work for a living, and they need a vocational program. There are some who want to become academics, and they need a high quality academic program. And there's plenty of people in between who need something to fit their needs. The education system must accommodate all kinds of learning styles, otherwise it's just going to keep on failing.

I also agree that compulsory education should be done away with. There are far too many who don't want to be there and just sit and vegetate because they don't want to be there. Some are outright hostile. Once compulsory education is done away with, the ones that do want to be there will be able to receive a much better education.

And I know exactly what you mean when you talk about students being forced into courses they're not ready for. I personally blame it on the age-based grade system, as too many have been held back when they could've done much greater things and too any have been passed forward into the next grade when it was obvious that they couldn't meet even the lowest benchmarks.

Well, that's enough from me for now. I've nothing but respect for you, for even if you do enable a broken system in some small way, your attempts to change the system are greatly appreciated, and your attitude shows that you are a good teacher. Have a nice stay, I wish to hear more from you later.


Re: Hello from a teacher - SoulRiser - 12-06-2009 07:27 AM

Please don't let the hostile idiots here scare you off... we have had a few trolls here lately, so some of us are overly paranoid.

It's always good to have a good teacher here... that doesn't happen very often. I hope you stick around. Smile

Quote:Do you think there's any validity to the idea that perhaps I can make a positive change from the inside? I've thought about that, too. I don't absolve myself from that by saying 'Oh, I'm just a cog in the wheel'. Like I stated before, it concerns me that I may be causing harm just by being a part of the system of compulsory education.

I don't know. John Taylor Gatto was a teacher for like 26 years, and then quit because he felt he was doing more harm than good. Grace Llewellyn (I can never spell her name)... was also a teacher, and quit because she felt that unschooling is far superior to anything a teacher can do in school.

I suppose it's possible to do more good than harm from inside the school, but I'm not entirely sure how... with all the restrictions to what teachers can and cannot do. It's not like you have a whole lot of options available.


Re: Hello from a teacher - Loxor - 12-06-2009 10:36 AM

Most of my teachers I think are awesome; I just extremely disagree with certain things they wish to teach me.

(As in; I'm not interested)

I do disagree with the fact that people who want to be in school, and are disruptive should be kicked out, until a certain level.

Also, what are we BLIND? For the most part I agree with him/her, and it seems others here do too. Why the attacks?


Re: Hello from a teacher - IllusoryDeath - 12-06-2009 10:43 AM

Welcome, TheCancer

Other than that, no comment....for now.


Re: Hello from a teacher - Colin - 12-06-2009 10:53 AM

TheCancer Wrote:Do you think there's any validity to the idea that perhaps I can make a positive change from the inside? I've thought about that, too. I don't absolve myself from that by saying 'Oh, I'm just a cog in the wheel'. Like I stated before, it concerns me that I may be causing harm just by being a part of the system of compulsory education.
We need more people like you, you know? If we had more teachers like Mr. Cancer over here, school would be that much more enjoyable. Of course, it's not often the teachers fault that school sucks, but people like you always bring me hope. You always need hope in a revolution.

Oh yeah, and welcome, by the way. I think you'll find many friends here, if you aren't a troll.


Re: Hello from a teacher - JW791 - 12-06-2009 01:23 PM

TheCancer Wrote:I deeply despise violence and think that people who commit violent crimes should be removed from society by means of execution.

Other than this line, nice post. I think most of us would agree that we're glad to have you here. The post doesn't seem very "troll-ish" to me. Welcome to SS.


Re: Hello from a teacher - Thought Criminal - 12-06-2009 02:46 PM

Welcome to ss cancer. Don't let the hostile fools let you down, there are plenty of sane people here such as I. Hopefully you can find the time to post on here regularly. we have had a few teachers in the past but they always seem to disappear after a while which is quite a shame because I enjoy seeing things from the perspective of the other side (that being teachers).